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Messages - Wilbur

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D.O.T. / Re: Quote of the day
« on: Today at 01:20:43 PM »

Sadly our pols ignore that on a daily basis and have for years. SMH

Faith Discussion / Re: Prayer Request thread
« on: February 22, 2018, 08:35:40 AM »
Definitely prayers being sent. Sorry to hear this.

D.O.T. / Re: ...Screening
« on: February 21, 2018, 04:14:27 PM »

CIEMR / Re: Floridaís teacher of the year
« on: February 21, 2018, 08:48:12 AM »
Great essay/post! Really well said!

School board will probably reprimand and fire her

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well,  aren?t we just full of sunshine & lolly pops this morning..... :tongue:


Faith Discussion / Re: Duanes home burned down today!
« on: February 18, 2018, 11:22:27 AM »
Don thank you for sharing that story about the roses. When I have doubts during difficulties, which sad to say I have more than I should, it's stories like this that always humble and re-center me.

Continued prayers for Duane and his family.

Faith Discussion / Re: Duanes home burned down today!
« on: February 17, 2018, 12:07:23 AM »
Oh man such awful news. So sorry to hear this. I am sure as bad as it is to lose so much it must be frightening for everyone too. Prayers said for this family tonight.

Anyone note the cost of a 2018 Suburban 2500 HD???...$80K for an LS!!!!!!

What's worse is I don't think it's a 2500....i think all they make now are 1500.....which sucks for sure. No idea why they don't do a 2500 with a Duramax as some have said. It would sell like heck.

Faith Discussion / Re: Prayer Request thread
« on: February 15, 2018, 12:09:26 AM »
So awful. I don't get why all schools don't have armed guards/cops at them. So sad.

Hide Site / Re: Hide site, retirement site.
« on: February 14, 2018, 06:08:27 PM »
Success!  CEE-ment pond holds water!

FIFY!  :beercheers:

D.O.T. / Re: Our flag
« on: February 14, 2018, 09:56:35 AM »
Thanks for posting this HC. I always hate it when I see someone with a flagpole without a light or a tattered flag.

D.O.T. / Re: Winter driving
« on: February 14, 2018, 09:52:50 AM »
Good safety tips there HC....Going to give this to my kids!

 :beercheers: :laugh:

D.O.T. / Re: THIS!
« on: February 13, 2018, 01:08:55 PM »
In the interest of good pilots here's a story I never heard about before....Don prob has....pretty amazing...The Gimli Glider


D.O.T. / Re: WDYDT (What Did You Do Today)
« on: February 12, 2018, 05:42:50 PM »
Glad that worked out for you Don. Knee stuff is no fun (mucho bad experience here), glad the recovery is going well.

Hide Site / Re: Hide site, retirement site.
« on: February 12, 2018, 08:51:50 AM »
Good luck but i think youre smart to plan it all out before you start pulling any wire. Do you have a friend you can send them to for a check to make sure you haven't missed anything?

I don't get what some places do so diagrams can be key. My FIL had tripped a GFCI on an outside outlet in his mfd house. None of the outside outlets had the reset. Fortunately the paperwork provided to him included a full wiring diagram, the reset was in a wall outlet in the MBR....um what? Thank God for the diagram, but no rhyme or reason to my way of thinking. Course I'm no electrician.....and I don't play one on TV. Ha

Hide Site / Re: Hide site, retirement site.
« on: February 11, 2018, 10:35:54 PM »
Had to pave the way for ya Ken! ;)

Hide Site / Re: Hide site, retirement site.
« on: February 11, 2018, 11:49:50 AM »
For the color, you have to do some planning. First find the color you really want (but don't tell her). Then start looking at camo designs.....leave brochures around with pictures. Then say you made your decision and tell her that as this is a bug out place you want to keep everything hush hush and quiet so you then show her the camo design so that it won't easily be seen from the air. After she calms down say "well we could do this color....." (the one you wanted to begin with). She'll be do happy you're not going with a camo design she'll say yes.

Lemme know how that works out. Haha.

D.O.T. / Re: TRNís secret stash found
« on: February 11, 2018, 11:37:28 AM »
Good thing Mexico's strict gun laws are working so well. The place is nirvana.....yeesh

D.O.T. / Re: THIS!
« on: February 09, 2018, 09:28:04 PM »
Damn that's unreal. Very cool. My Dad was involved in a lot if power lines in NE.  He said they always hired Indians (feather not dot) to run the wires. Said they were better at the heights. Dunno if thats still the case.

CIEMR / Re: Martial law along Coloradoís southern border
« on: February 09, 2018, 09:23:06 PM »
So someone cared about the "net " cost not the BS that "illegals pay some taxes so we should invite them" nonsense. God I get sick of hearing that. Sadly times he changed in CO.....and elsewhere!

Hide Site / Re: Hide site, retirement site.
« on: February 07, 2018, 05:32:04 PM »
That will be really nice when its done!

Hide Site / Re: Hide site, retirement site.
« on: February 07, 2018, 11:07:27 AM »
What about a wood boiler for the hot tub? How often will you be at the site? Not like you have to heat it all the time anyway right? I don't know how fast it would come up to temp but that might be doable. 

Please looks really great Charles!

D.O.T. / Re: SpaceX launch
« on: February 06, 2018, 09:14:19 PM »
Yeah, some cro-magnon alien in another world will see that thing land and start worshiping it......

Could be a mocie.....The Aliens Must Be Crazy maybe?

Really really awesome. I love this for so many reasons....obviously the kicking butt with new tech etc, but also it just shows what motivated ppl can do and prove that the govt is not the "be all and end all" for a lot. I loved what NASA accomplished but every day you guys are taking some of the shine off that rose. Hopefully some other Americans are paying attention. Very cool! Love it!!

Agreed. I was hoping for that as well. Can't imagine what it would be like to be in his shoes.


I'm guessing prison guards aren't so quick to respond. He'll get his, and it won't be pretty. But it will be deserving.

Farming, Gardening, and Raising Your Own Food / Re: Raised veggie garden.
« on: February 05, 2018, 08:19:07 PM »
There's been a fair amount of study on it and it appears that the new ones are okay. The old PT seems safe too but I can see using the newer stuff to be safe.



Farming, Gardening, and Raising Your Own Food / Re: Raised veggie garden.
« on: February 03, 2018, 01:23:00 PM »
Looks good! I'm sure it will produce a lot for you. I agree with testing the soil but it might make sense to wait to see how the soil breaks down and then see what nutrients are lacking.

D.O.T. / Re: WDYDT (What Did You Do Today)
« on: February 03, 2018, 10:51:23 AM »
Grand canyon is such an amazing place. Very humbling.

Well we're getting some of that balmy Midwest weather....6 degrees overnight. 10 now. Perfect for pulled pork for tomorrow's game. Ha. No sipping sweet tea in the shade today though.

D.O.T. / Re: Don re-enters the workforce
« on: February 03, 2018, 10:49:14 AM »
That thing needs wheelie bars! Ha!

D.O.T. / Re: State of The Union Transcript
« on: January 31, 2018, 10:54:26 PM »
One of the best SOTU speeches I've ever heard. Just awesome!!

CIEMR / Re: Trump Amnesty OFFER
« on: January 31, 2018, 12:14:28 PM »
He?s also painting the Libs into a corner - counter their absurd NO RESTRICTIONS demand with down the middle compromise AND include more schemers in the deal and watch them self destruct trying to make people believe it?s a bad deal......

More and more I agree with this cuda. Having seen how the Dems came away from the "shutdown" with egg on their faces for putting illegals over the troops and citizens I think he decided to really go for it. Schumer had wanted 800K, Trump raised it to 1.8MM and now Schumer says no? Unreal. But if he holds firm on the wall, ending chain migration and the visa lottery PLUS has the 12 year path to citizenship and people who break the law get tossed, it could work very well. And Democrats will have a hard time painting 1.8MM as "bad", they will continue to look stupid.

I thought he described it well during the SOTU speech last night- that in a negotiation both sides have to give up something to get the deal done. And with Pelosi et al sitting on their hands and scowling at everything I think that bodes well for Trump because he seemed reasonable by offering even more than what the Dems asked for in the first place. And lets face it, all the things Trump wants (the wall, chain migration ending and ending the visa lottery) American citizens want. IIRC the last poll of Americans (not just Republicans) was something like 80% for those things. 

Newt predicted the Dems will break into two groups- the crazy progressive left group and the "old style" fiscal conservative Democrats. I think there he may be right. The more the left runs people like Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren up the flag pole the more "Independents" will vote Republican, especially given the successes Trump has had.

I thought it was pretty amazing all the things he listed off last night. Just a crazy amount of positives. That it all occurred within a year is just unreal. Judges, the economy, companies hiring and bringing $ back to the US, ISIS getting hammered, all in 1 year? Crazy.

CIEMR / Trump Amnesty OFFER
« on: January 29, 2018, 10:52:45 PM »
So I was sputtering when I saw that Trump had put "amnesty" on the table. But after I calmed down a bit I wondered if maybe Trump was painting the Democrats into a corner much like he did on the shutdown. Let's face it, these guys are politicians and he's been navigating the NY Real Estate market with all the people there is a lot tougher in my mind.

So then after seeing the Democrats still screaming racism and thinking they just look like utter fools for complaining about what they wanted I started wondering if Trump was ahead of them again. And then I saw this article on the whole thing:


I feel a bit better. Not completely convinced yet but I can see this working to some degree. And if he ends chain migration and the visa lottery system that could be a good thing. And I wasn't aware of what the 12 year path meant but if that comes with "hey, you're out" for any f-ups, I like that idea. And over 12 years it seems to me it will weed out the dirtbag's.

What's your take on this.

D.O.T. / Re: So our backyard pig converted to islam.
« on: January 27, 2018, 01:14:29 PM »
How many virgins do pigs get in heaven? I think you should ask CAIR for the answer. Hahaha

CIEMR / Re: I Love it, I Love it, I really, really Love it...
« on: January 24, 2018, 11:12:55 AM »
Pretty amazing how someone as inept and stupid as the MSM makes Trump out to be can accomplish all this in 1 short year. I asked a liberal friend the other day if Trump is as stupid as you say he is, what does that say about Chuck Schumer and the Dems that he beat them like a rented mule on the government shut down? haha. I love it!

Boats & Waterborne Craft / Re: New motor for the seahawk boat...
« on: January 24, 2018, 11:09:21 AM »
I'm sorry that all those bad things happened but I will say that a boat engine suddenly stopping and a bilge pump not working and getting swamped can have pretty disastrous consequences depending on the where and when it occurs. While I am sure the last thing you want to think about is that you were "blessed" by kissing a big fancy yacht when the engine failed, compared to having that happen in the big seas that were out there and drifting in front of a big ship or onto some wave battered rocks, that may have been a blessing.

Hope you find a solution that works!   

D.O.T. / Re: WDYDT (What Did You Do Today)
« on: January 24, 2018, 10:58:39 AM »
had some fun yesterday.....wok up to a nice cover a ice on everything....getting the daughter to school was an adventure. I was surprised it wasnt delayed (lots of times if we get a fast ice event they'll delay school for a couple of hours. For some reason both the public schools and my daughter's didnt (she goes to a local Christian school). But later in the day I got to see this video from a couple of streets away from us. Fortunately no one hurt.


But yesterday was also my FIL's move. The icing stopped but it still poured all day so it was fun. But we got him moved out of our house where's he's been since he sold his house and into his new retirement living community. He's now there permanent.

I will just say there is a God. :)

Construction and Building / Re: "12 Square" a 12' X 12' shed project
« on: January 23, 2018, 08:28:22 AM »
Looks good Don. Good to get more storage for sure.

The Dad of a buddy of mine built his own place when he got back from WWII. He was a gunsmith and the first floor was concrete block foundation. He cut a couple of grooves at the top of some of the blocks and every night his change was sorted and put into them. My buddy had no idea until his Dad took him in there when he was getting ready to move- he had a small cold chisel and hammer, knocked out a couple of holes on the bottom blocks and the change just started flowing out- quarters in a couple, nickels in another, dimes, etc...all presorted. He said they were bagging it for a long time. Lots of places to hide stuff in concrete block if it's planned for.

CIEMR / Re: Government Shut Down
« on: January 20, 2018, 02:10:18 PM »
Agree with all of this TRN! I think social media helps get the true message on DACA and the shutdown past the MSM so Americans know the truth. I saw a CNN poll that blamed Dems (31%) for the shutdown more than Trump (21%) or Repubs (26%) - yes combined more blame Trump and R's but i thought that was a very good sign that it wasnt 2% blaming Dems.

I do think this huge fight on DACA is Dems trying to redirect attention over the Obama/Hillary corruption that is starting to come out as you referenced on "the memo". I too think people will end up going to jail over it. I just wish the MSM would wake up and realize this is such a problem for the country beyond ideological/party stuff.

Most Favored Companies / Re: sams club closings
« on: January 11, 2018, 10:40:47 PM »
Dang....mines closing too. It had the cheapest gas around. I used to shop there all the time when the kids were little (diapers, wipes, etc.). They also had good prices on full rib roasts etc I could cut up.  Don't go there much lately other than for gas, but I did get things occasionally.

Gun Control / Re: Yea, so let's get to know the gun control gurus
« on: January 10, 2018, 11:26:25 AM »
Its interesting as much as I HATE social media I do think this is one area where it has helped (in some ways).....I think that many people are now aware (even if they don't own guns) just how important having armed citizens in society is. After the church shooting in Texas there were tons of posts on Facebook Twitter etc reminding people that it was a good guy with a gun that stopped a bad guy with a gun. That message gets shared a lot and its hard for folks to deny it. I also think it has helped that people see the meme's shared that the 2nd Amendment is not about hunting, but is about GOVERNMENT control.

Yes the liberal weenies will all continue to scream about more gun control etc. but just as in a national election the key is to get the independents (Trump was never going to get the true Hillary Kool-Aid drinkers to vote for him), gun control nonsense is about teaching the "independents" about just how important gun rights are for ALL citizens.

The thing I bring up over and over whenever I have a conversation with people who "don't like guns" (and believe me they are bleeping everywhere here in MA) is how liberalized carry laws help EVERY citizen, not just those who carry because criminals will change their behavior. I ask them if its good that we have seat belt laws ( which I hate even though I wear one....just hate the idea that there is a law about them!), they of course say yes its good. I ask them if they will be protected in a car crash if they don't wear one. Of course the answer is no. But then I explain that with liberal carry laws criminals don't know who is carrying or not so they change their behavior- they rob homes when no one is home, they steal empty cars in a parking lot or whatever. But they don't engage in crimes where they may come in contact with the victim cause they might get shot. So liberalized carry laws help ALL citizens not just those who choose to avail themselves of it. And I end it with something like, "I get it, you hate guns, would never own one. That's fine, it is your right to choose that. But wouldn't you like to be protected from violence even without having to arm yourself?" For those who are truly on the fence or not just knee-jerk liberals who think guns fire themselves, they start to get it. Not saying I have made a difference here in MA (Lord knows that ain't happening!) But I feel its a start.

(If they are old enough I ask them if they remember when criminals were killing tourists in FL and the car rental places had to take the stickers off their cars....if they remember it I explain that this was criminals "changing their behavior" because FL had just passed a right to carry law and criminals realized if they robbed citizens they could get shot, so they robbed people who they KNEW wouldn't have guns (and probably had cash)- those who just flew there from somewhere else for Disney, the beaches or whatever).

Sorry.....another rant. I gotta stop at 2 cups of coffee in the AM! haha.  :shocked:

Gun Control / Re: Never ending assault upon our basic rights
« on: January 10, 2018, 11:13:12 AM »
Good on you Mr Wil for at least trying. Of course they hung up on you, because they can't argue against facts.

PERZACTLY!  :likebutton:

Gun Control / Re: Never ending assault upon our basic rights
« on: January 10, 2018, 11:12:38 AM »
I think the citizens who find themselves living in such places are going to have to get out and fight for their rights or they will surrender them. I think the fight will be unfair and you will suffer casualties as a legal system which is liberal and stacked against you perverts the law through progressive judges to package you good citizens in such a way as to resemble the boston marathon killers.

They get away with that because people aren't doing anything. How did a bunch of sheep get control of you sheep dogs anyway? Bite em! Put them in their place, use your proverbial teeth. Start with your own demands for justice.

Like I have said before, start with your own demands. I like the concept of lawmakers and judges having to publically share their medical records and lets also ask for political and professional affiliations. How about that city councilman who was a member of the communist party while in college who was diagnoised as borderline bi-polar?

Don I like all that you said. Ultimately we are witnessing here in this state exactly what the Founding Fathers intended with the states- that being individual "experiments" in laws where citizens would move in or out depending on the laws enacted in the state. The problem being we are seeing increased growth, but its the WRONG kind!

So every time the census comes out I look at all the states populations versus the last census and compare which ones have had gains over the typical "net gain" (I would have to go dig up the spreadsheet but iirc its 1.5% - meaning if the population had no new immigrants or emmigrants it would grow at 1.5%- Population X plus new births less deaths). Those states who's population growth exceeded 1.5% meant they had more people moving in and those with growth less than 1.5% had people moving out. TX, FL and other low tax states have had net increases far exceeding the "normal" growth rate reflecting exactly what you would think- people vote with their dollars and move from high tax states to low tax states.

But in MA we are seeing a problematic trend- because we have liberal bleeping everything which includes welfare, food stamps, etc. we are seeing people move in for the benefits. So we have a shrinking population of workers supporting a rising population of leeches and ticks. They of course elect exactly who they want to (which are more of the liberal jerks who want their votes so continue to make them dependent on the welfare systems they promote). Its a vicious cycle and will implode eventually.

When we last went through this it was right after Dukakis ran for President with the (fake) Massachusetts Miracle. Everyone here knew the state was failing but he buffaloed enough on the left to get on the ticket. Fortunately (for the country) he lost the election. But then the state was in deep doo doo financially. Bill Weld got elected Governor on a platform of reforming welfare by requiring people "work" (I put that in quotes because there were all sorts of loopholes but it was a good start) if they received welfare benefits. Before the law ever went into effect 1/2 of the welfare recipients got off welfare and got jobs. No joke. HALF!!! So it was good, obviously. Then the state went through the next incarnation of liberal BS and elected Obama's buddy Deval Patrick (I am going through all this because you will likely see his name in 2020 as liberals want him to run) for Governor. The very first law he rescinded was the "Workfare" law Weld had pushed through. So now NH and ME are starting pilot programs with "workfare" and those leeches are all moving here for benefits because no one checks anything. Its disgusting. The MA legislature is 85% Democrat on the Senate side and 79% Democrat on the House side. Republicans can not pass ANY legislation on their own. Nor can they stop legislation no matter how insane.

Last year (maybe 2 years ago? I forget now), Republicans proposed a bill that would strip EBT "rights" from stores found to be engaged in fraudulent activities (we have some "convenience" stores that will have $500 a week in cash sales but $100,000 a week in "EBT" (food stamp) sales- these are the ones giving EBT holders $0.50 on the $1.00 for their EBT cards so the holder can go buy booze and drugs). The Democrats voted 100% on party lines to shoot down the legislation. Right now in the state if you "lose" your EBT card (which instead of being like a credit card tied to your "account", is more like a gift card with cash tied to the card) you just go get another one, BUT THEY DONT CANCEL THE ONE YOU LOST!!!! So drug dealers routinely get arrested with 20-30 or more EBT cards on them as their customers trade the EBT cards for drugs. But the  Democrats here won't stop that BS either.     

Sorry I got off on a bit of a tirade here, but most on this site won't believe that this kind of nonsense occurs (well exceptin' the folks in CA as they see it too). I mention it because we WILL see these people pushing at the federal level for office in 2020 (Elizabeth Warren and the previously mentioned Deval Patrick) so its important to know who we are dealing with.

For me? I can not WAIT to get the heck out of here. My youngest is a junior in high school and as soon as she graduates I will be gone like the wind. I may keep a house here as long as my Mom and FIL are alive but I will "live", for tax purposes (and gun purposes), elsewhere.

Sorry....rant off.  :facepalm:

Gun Control / Re: Never ending assault upon our basic rights
« on: January 09, 2018, 02:47:36 PM »
Glad you started this forum section Don. Of course the pols in my state have all drunk the Kool-Aid and consider me a terrorist for owning guns. Fortunately we have an active anti-gun group that can and does push back on occasion. Its just that its so little and so late. The pols here are all of the mindset that black guns are bad. They made bumpstocks illegal about a week after the LV shooting.

In an attempt to get fewer people to carry they came out with two classes of pistol permits....one a "small capacity" permit (good for 6 rounds or less), and a "high capacity" permit. Oh, but they didn't tell the public the fine print....the Small Capacity permit only allows you to have a pistol outside your house in a locked container going to a gun club or back. In order to carry concealed you need the High Capacity permit, which of course a lot of guys who usually carry revolvers said "nah, I don't need that one." Not knowing that they were effectively cutting off their own noses.

When John Lott's book More Guns Less Crime came out our local Attorney General was on a radio talk show. I called and asked him if he had read it. He said no. I said "You're the top law enforcement officer in the state. Gun violence is a problem, shouldn't you have the most up to date information on gun crimes and laws in the country so you can guide policy in a way that is effective? This is the only study that looked at every county in the country. I think you owe it to the taxpayers who pay your salary to read it and be informed of the facts." They hung up on me. SMH.  Have I said I hate this state?

Share Your Recipe / Re: Home made chicken soup
« on: January 09, 2018, 02:29:28 PM »
Looks good! We have a ham bone that will be pea soup in a day or so. The wife is always making chicken soup from cooked chickens. Its so good and as TRN says so much better than anything canned. Plus you can add whatever you have on hand so not wasting what otherwise might get spoiled or tossed out.

My wife is a label reader and paranoid about the additives in stuff so we've just started buying dried beans (which is great in my mind cause they are so much cheaper). She makes a Tuscan bean soup with white beans....mmm....like a pea soup in that some of them break up completely and thicken the broth. That and some crusty bread and I am gtg! Homemade soup is awesome!  :likebutton:

CIEMR / Re: Operation Condor
« on: January 08, 2018, 09:45:28 AM »
Even if half of this is accurate there should be a ton of indictments.  So awful. I notice every time more info is about to be dropped Maxine Watters or some of the other idjits start yelling really loudly to impeach Trump or something else in an attempt to distract the public. That suggests to me it's all true.

Farming, Gardening, and Raising Your Own Food / Re: EGGS finally...
« on: January 06, 2018, 12:27:40 AM »
I never had a problem with cold bit the lack of daylight shuts down laying. Having a light on a timer will keep them going through th winter. It stimulates their pituitary gland which regulates egg production from what I read.

Afaik as long as they only have about 4-6 square feet or so per bird in the coop you don't need a heat lamp. We had plenty of below zero temps. But if there's only a few chickens where they have too much room then maybe some extra heat would be warranted i dont know. 

D.O.T. / Re: WDYDT (What Did You Do Today)
« on: January 05, 2018, 11:17:21 PM »
Started today where I ended last night....bloeing snow. Didn't get too much, about 10" or so but cold and about a 30 mph wind. Temp dropped all day today and it's now 3 with that wind still pushing. Supposed to be about -10 below tomorrow night and still with wind. Should be interesting. We're having a family party so I just put a brisket on the grille (yeah....its 11:00 pm), the cold has me a bit nervous. Never cooked BBQ when the snow is piled up and the wind howling. Should be interesting. I'm gonna cheat though in about 3 hours bring it in, wrap it in foil and finish it in the oven at 225. I can't stay up all night sipping whiskey and listening to the birds tonight. Ha!

Farming, Gardening, and Raising Your Own Food / Re: EGGS finally...
« on: December 30, 2017, 10:10:25 PM »
Ha....that sounds about right (19 eggs from 13 chickens)....in a month or two they'll settle down for about 1 a day.

Guineas are great watch birds but noisy as heck. Yikes.

Napoleon Ha! Roosters are good... can help rebuild the flock but if he gets aggressive toss him in the pot. I had a few that went that way when they got too big for their britches.

Good for you guys! Great addition. Especially with the "flock" you have inside the house! Ha.

Faith Discussion / Re: Prayer Request thread
« on: December 30, 2017, 07:22:40 PM »
Prayers sent JR. I hope it's nothing too serious.

Farming, Gardening, and Raising Your Own Food / Re: EGGS finally...
« on: December 29, 2017, 05:27:06 PM »
Nice! How many hens? What breed? They are usually all over the place when they first start laying then they settle down. You using a light to keep them regular? (Laying that is! Ha)

Hand Tools, Power Tools, Welders, etc / Re: Dewalt 20Volt impact gun
« on: December 27, 2017, 09:05:08 PM »
Don see the last post in this thread...


I was doing the same thing and couldnt break a lugnut. I used a breaker bar expecting it was going to kill me after i couldn't find a cheater bar to use. I was astonished (and PO'd) that it was so easy to break free. I'm glad to have one but I bought it to have in the truck for flats figuring it's a lot faster than the old 4 way. But I may be wrong. Sheesh.

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