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Offline Higher Caliber

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My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« on: October 02, 2015, 04:08:31 AM »
(note, I wrote this in an endeavor to be neutral on RTKBA, for educational purposes and to spur some commentary from both sides about the, for lack of a better term wussification of our youth. I think we all *here* know where I stand.)

Crapper Perspective-

This evening on the radio, I heard a staunchly conservative, pro 2A, individual call for a certification process for gun owners in the United States of America. I then heard President Barack Obama; in an almost furious tone again call for stricter gun control measures. A friend of mine mentioned this is the 15th such address the president has made during his tenure in response to a spree killing. Our populace grows weary of violence with every breaking news headline, yet we lie in wait for our turn to be victimized and still don’t really do anything about it.

Here in Joplin, the majority felt it a luxury to equip their abodes with storm shelters until the storm of the century wiped out a third of the city and claimed over 160 souls. Now the city scape is littered with storm shelters and if you don’t own one, your neighbor probably does and you have access to it. When people re-build after fires, the first thing on their mind is a state of the art smoke detection system. If unfortunately we are burglarized, we make the call immediately to arm our home with the best alarm system we can afford. When we come down with an illness due to an unhealthy lifestyle, we relentlessly seek mitigation to return to good health.

Yet when it comes to violence, the weary people rely on hope or pray they will not be victimized. The law-makers on the right fight to preserve the right of the people to keep and bear the tools necessary to defend themselves, while the left leaning law-makers call for measures to keep the same tools out of the hands of people who intend to use them for violence. With good intentions (hopefully) they both seek to bring safety and security to us. For whatever reason, this is where it stops. Occasionally you hear the “never again” stories of the individual who made the decision personal security was their own burden to bear, but the vast majority, hopes or prays and waits for someone else to establish security on their behalf.

Where does this mentality come from? The mentality that self-reliance is imperative up to and until we are confronted with violence? When we are hungry, we eat... When we are un-quenched, we drink... When we are cold, we make a fire… But when we are met with a foe bearing an impeccable will to destroy us, we just hope or pray. You wouldn’t hope or pray not to be ejected from a car in an accident. You wear your seatbelt, drive defensively, and you pay attention to your surroundings! Yet still, when confronted with harm at the hands of another, again you hope or pray they will change their mind and spare you.

It is our culture to teach our children, starting at a very young age, that violence doesn’t solve problems. Truly, you can’t solve all problems with violence. What kind of society would we be if we tried? If a lady stands in the middle of the aisle at Wal-Mart, oblivious to your endeavor to get to the pickles, it would be socially un-acceptable to round-house kick her. Violence does however solve *some* problems. Specifically, problems of the violent category are solved with a proportionate amount of violence instituted swiftly in return.
 
 If we want to continually see the victimization of our people, then we should just maintain the status quo. If we wish to implement a strategy of defense against violence, it starts with the individual and developing them to realize there is more to self-reliance than basic sustenance. We must prepare a canvas within our youth which reflects hope and embraces prayer, but is not solely reliant upon it during a violent encounter. The tools of defense are debatable, but the gumption to defend one’s self is paramount.
"Lions mustn't concern themselves with the opinions of sheep"
           
                                    Molon Labe!

Offline cudakidd53

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2015, 07:01:28 AM »
Well put HC-

To some degree it's our "zero tolerance" policies in elementary schools where we've conditioned the average and well mannered child from standing up for themselves or others for fear of being expelled.  Much of this is due to spineless adults in positions of authority who are too chicken crap to "make the call" whether or not little jimmy had it coming so they suspend or expel both.

Same with everyone gets a trophy, self-esteem and a myriad of other stupid "programs" that make it easier for adults so that they don't have to have "conversations" with kids or their parents about why they didn't win and if they don't like it they should change themselves to get better.

All of this and other things like it (political correctness) come about because someone(s) is too chicken crap to deliver the hard messages!

Did our dictator in chief call this persecution of Christians yet?  Will he?  Another jihadists going to be sanitized as "disturbed" instead of offending our new, national religion?
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2015, 07:37:26 AM »
"please don't eat me cried the little sheep to the wolf"

A conversation that has happened many times between my wife and I goes like this:

Wife" honey, you can't change people"
Me"That may be, but a well placed A$$ whoopin goes a long way to effect behavior change"

Another cerebral discussion post there, Blaine,  Well done.

Like anti bullying programs in school.  When there is someone who violates the societal covenant not to physically harm another member of society, the answer is that the society rises up and administers justice in the form of equal or greater violence.  It has operated that way since God put Adam on this earth.  Only now do we have the wussification, as you put it, of our society by the weak, overly idealistic members of our society who fear violence in any form.  Thus they cower behind a stack of paper laws which are ineffective at stopping a determined criminal.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2015, 03:22:20 PM by TexasRedNeck »
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2015, 10:11:02 AM »
I love it

And I know it's plagerized from somewhere

HC is a grunt

and grunts can't write like that

So I know he copied it from someone  ;)

Well written piece and it calls out the mental cancer which he referred to early in his piece. I call it cowardice...I'm old school. Looks like a duck, quacks like a duce, it's a dam duck!

Men and women need to find their courage. To do everything. In my HOA where I am the president, some neighbors will ask me to say something to this neighbor or that. My response to one: "Grow a pair and go tell him yourself!"

I'll make this short

America, "Grow a pair!"
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2015, 10:23:27 AM »
I feel smarter everytime I read somethin like that from Blaine, Don, Tex, Mike, well just about everyone on here that has the talent of puttin words together.
I wasn't blessed with that gift (or skill). Good job and spot on.
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2015, 11:38:47 AM »
Wise words again as the community organizer blames the gun again.

All the elites have armed security for their family, even their kids at school. But that is not good enough for us. A good size of the population are just sheeple, hoping for the best.

I hate local events for obvious reasons and another reason I carry all the time.
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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2015, 12:52:08 PM »
Yes, carry all the time

We here should be wearing the coatings off the front end of our pistols!
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2015, 12:55:56 PM »
Funny, my duty 22 has very little wear for 20 years of use. During transport it was probably out of the holster 20 times a day.
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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2015, 03:12:03 PM »
Funny, my duty 22 has very little wear for 20 years of use. During transport it was probably out of the holster 20 times a day.
Me, I'm holstering up, then taking it out when in the car, then holstering up again for dinner, church, doctors appointment, Walmart, auto parts, the farm, then off then on...
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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2015, 11:50:26 AM »
I carry everywhere that I can.  Working on military installations and inside secure facilities is not conducive to being armed all of the time.  My company (officially) frowns on carrying but so what.  I would much rather search for a new job that the alternate.  Had a great experience with my wife this weekend.  We were looking at handguns for her so she can carry more that she does.  She defiantly sees the need to carry as more and more things are going crazy.
Matt
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2015, 12:07:33 PM »
What cal you looking for? I am a 40 fan but 9mm has come a long way.

Look at the SW MP, you will like either way!
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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2015, 12:57:07 PM »
We both currently have 40's.  I just got a Ruger LCP 380 for those times when I can't carry my G27.  She is kind of interested in something smaller for herself as well as it is usually so warm here that it can be hard to choose clothes around a gun.  Especially for a woman.  She was liking the Sig Scorpion in either 9 or 380.

I am looking around here to see if one of the ranges has a rental. 
« Last Edit: October 05, 2015, 01:06:32 PM by Atkinsmatt »
Matt
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2015, 03:03:02 PM »
MP Shield in the 40 or 9mm. If you want lighter the keltec PF9 is very light and has more rounds and a +1 for them now.

I have the PF9, Sheild40 and LCP.

Here is my claw behind the PF9, Shield 40 a tad bigger and the LCP.

LCP feels like a toy to me, PF9 has a good feel and the Shield 40 is even better.

« Last Edit: October 05, 2015, 03:07:06 PM by JR »
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2015, 03:09:48 PM »
PF9 is a little closer to the camera,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ;D
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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2015, 03:40:12 PM »
I haven't done a review on the LCP yet but it fills a need for all of the time carry when the clothes are lighter in the warm weather.  I am liking it so far.  It rides well in the front pocket of my wranglers, short or long.  I have the Blackhawk size 1 holster for it and while it prints, it looks like a wallet instead of a gun.  I would prefer to have the G27 but it is not always an option.

My wife is looking for a smaller sized weapon to help with the decrease the wardrobe conflicts that arise.  Also to stop off body carry (in purse) as much as possible.  We all know a 22 in the hand is better than a 45 in the truck.  I am thankful that she is willing to carry and put some serious thought into weapon selection, the pretty factor still has to be addressed.  I have let her know that we can get whatever gun she chooses finished whatever color she likes.
Matt
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2015, 03:46:18 PM »
I can carry the 23 in my work shorts, but it is heavy and fairly obvious.

9mm +p in the purse, 8 rounds and 20 oz? Tuff to beat and probably fits a female hand better. It even has a rail if you want a laser or light.
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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #16 on: October 05, 2015, 03:53:36 PM »
Saturday was the first of hopefully several visits and some good range time to select the just right weapon.  Fortunately there is a local range with many rentals and another not to far away. 
Matt
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Offline cudakidd53

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #17 on: October 05, 2015, 04:54:03 PM »
I think the holster makes the difference- got the Cross Breed IWB in horsehide so it absorbs sweat better and is more comfortable against the skin.  I've used it with shorts, pants, jeans etc and with dress shirt or t-shirt tucked and "bloused out" effectively carry with confidence.  Still feels funny in Church though and have to not swivel hips in the pew to avoid a "clunk".  This is with a XDs in .45 so smaller applications should be even easier.
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #18 on: October 05, 2015, 07:03:44 PM »
The LCP is a better than nothing category.  Although most encounters are going to be very very close range, almost a contact shot, for which the LCP would probably be sufficient with good ammo.  Further than about 5 feet away, its a little hard to hold on target.

One of the new single stack 9mm would be a good compromise
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Higher Caliber

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #19 on: October 05, 2015, 08:22:27 PM »
Wearing shorts and fitted t-shirt I can conceal my G19 easily with a IWB holster at 3-330 position. Carrying a gun, while not comfortable should be comforting... Heard that smwr.
You learn to adjust your wardrobe, wearing darker clothes helps a lot! Get a good heavy belt that supports the weapon on an axis. You will be surprised how comfortable it becomes as well as comforting! Y'all really derailed the heck outa this thread!!!


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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #20 on: October 05, 2015, 09:16:01 PM »
G19/G23 hard to beat for a go to pistole.

Wearing it outside the belt has been a challenge. Now that the weather is cooling off a bit, wearing a suit jacket to dinner, church, meetings, and the like makes that a simple conceal.

Other times I am open carrying more now than I used to. Did it all day today down at the farm, but no one about there, so maybe doesn't count.

Bottom line you need to stay armed most all the time, so just figure it out...
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Offline cudakidd53

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #21 on: October 05, 2015, 10:27:23 PM »
Addition to HC's post- I wear a lot of plaid shirts- breaks up lines really well.  Also known as Art Teacher's camouflage as it hides spots well too.  Paint, ink, blood from cuts, drool from Oxygen Thieves and that's just from lunch in the teachers lounge!  :)
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #22 on: October 05, 2015, 11:20:27 PM »
I have a nice fobus for the 23/22 when I don't care if it is seen. For the pocket the same pocket holster works for Shield and the 23, cargo pants are great for that and comfy.

I still have not found an inside the pants holster I'm happy with yet. Small of the back is nice and allows access when seated. I used to carry the 1911 when hunting in a shoulder holster. Worked pretty good and the 2 mags offset the wieght.
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #23 on: October 06, 2015, 07:23:02 AM »
Try the comp tac. Either the Minotaur or Infidel. I carry the g30 in the Minotaur and the g23 in the infidel.  And no, not at the same time!  Like Blaine, I prefer the 3:30 with FBI cant


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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2015, 09:13:07 AM »
You are right.  The LCP is a get off me gun and I carry it knowing that.  I like 3:30 for my G27 and it is the go to.  I have been carrying OWB but am going to get a IWB holster to use to add another option.  The LCP is for when I can't go with it.

For the wife, we are looking closely at a couple different weapons and I am getting it lined up to do some shooting with them to help with selection.  We have had many conversations about pros and cons of each and the need to PRACTICE once a selection is made. 
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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #25 on: October 06, 2015, 10:05:23 AM »
I have a nice fobus for the 23/22 when I don't care if it is seen. For the pocket the same pocket holster works for Shield and the 23, cargo pants are great for that and comfy.

I still have not found an inside the pants holster I'm happy with yet. Small of the back is nice and allows access when seated. I used to carry the 1911 when hunting in a shoulder holster. Worked pretty good and the 2 mags offset the wieght.
I tried a shoulder holster the other weekend, over a "T" and under an unbuttoned LS shirt. Without the cross the chest strap it would flap about and was obvious.
Outside the waist at the three o'clock position tends to bump into things and is uncomfortable after a while. I am using various paddle holsters...I want to say the positive retention uncle mike is the one I usually go to when I have a round chambered.
Opspec is advertising some "Comfortable" inside the waist band holsters. But with additional layers of Neoprene you get to looking like, well, how can I put this...You get to looking like the "Typical" American.
Come to think about it, perhaps that is a good cammo technique...Just dress big
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #26 on: October 06, 2015, 08:29:50 PM »
I want to say the positive retention uncle mike is the one I usually go to when I have a round chambered.

Forgive me for being so bold, sir.  But should you not always carry in the same condition to avoid the dreaded "click of death"?  I always carry condition 1 so I don't have any question about what condition my weapon is in.

Come to think about it, perhaps that is a good cammo technique...Just dress big

Agreed.  A good belt and a big shirt make it hard for even HC to determine if I'm carrying
« Last Edit: October 06, 2015, 08:31:07 PM by TexasRedNeck »
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #27 on: October 06, 2015, 08:47:13 PM »
I want to say the positive retention uncle mike is the one I usually go to when I have a round chambered.

Forgive me for being so bold, sir.  But should you not always carry in the same condition to avoid the dreaded "click of death"?  I always carry condition 1 so I don't have any question about what condition my weapon is in.

Come to think about it, perhaps that is a good cammo technique...Just dress big

Agreed.  A good belt and a big shirt make it hard for even HC to determine if I'm carrying

I've done it that way for so long, its a habit now...
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Offline Higher Caliber

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2015, 01:44:05 AM »
Redneck,

I have seen pictures of you on here... I would profile you as a carrier... Easy to do. That's how I start my flow chart assessment matrix.

It doesn't matter what I wear, people always ask, "are you a cop?" *or* I get, "You are either a cop, or in the military..." I took my girls for ice cream the other day, little old lady walks up, "thank you for your service" I was in my standard, cargo shorts, t-shirts, and tennis shoes... I cant shake it. I always ask, "How can you tell?" I either get, "just the way you carry yourself" or "I could just tell"...

Funny caveat- I can stop the mope mobile with my red and blues, driver bails, I chase them down screaming, "POLICE OFFICER STOP!" and when I catch them and ask them why they run? "I didn't know you was the POlice and I got skeered" oh, and "these aint even my pants dawg, I just found these"
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #29 on: October 07, 2015, 07:37:13 AM »
Yeah, you're right.  You may not be able to tell, but you'll "know".  It seems like every time I get pulled over I get asked if I'm on the job.

Goes to show we all profile.  No amount of PC crap is going to keep human nature from making assumptions.  Its part of our survival matrix.
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline cudakidd53

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #30 on: October 07, 2015, 08:41:27 AM »
Yeah, you're right.  You may not be able to tell, but you'll "know".  It seems like every time I get pulled over I get asked if I'm on the job.

Goes to show we all profile.  No amount of PC crap is going to keep human nature from making assumptions.  Its part of our survival matrix.

Ahhh, I'm in stealth mode........."he's a nerdy Art Teacher......probably likes sushi" Buuuaahha haaa!
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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #31 on: October 07, 2015, 09:27:14 AM »
Yeah, you're right.  You may not be able to tell, but you'll "know".  It seems like every time I get pulled over I get asked if I'm on the job.

Goes to show we all profile.  No amount of PC crap is going to keep human nature from making assumptions.  Its part of our survival matrix.

Ahhh, I'm in stealth mode........."he's a nerdy Art Teacher......probably likes sushi" Buuuaahha haaa!
You can pull that off?
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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #32 on: October 07, 2015, 09:31:54 AM »
It doesn't matter what I wear, people always ask, "are you a cop?" *or* I get, "You are either a cop, or in the military..."
Me too, probably most of us
Rode my bike down to rabbit hash...local biker place because of the senic spot along the ohio river. I pull in like I own the place. All the bikers look to me like clones, but doesn't matter. I go there to get a sarsaparilla...ever heard of it?
Old time soda pop that I like
So this guy starts following me and talking...and asking stuff. He's a bit of a pest and is on a scooter, not a real bike. After awhile he yells over his shoulder, "Military." I asked him why he did that. He said when you pulled in you parked in the middle of us, and you're not wearing black, so we figured you were either a cop or military!
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #33 on: October 07, 2015, 09:32:44 AM »
At the risk of sounding ignorant, can you guys explain why it's a "bad" idea to open carry? I don't think I've heard of a guy getting taken out just because he was packin'....at least not a civie. Maybe I live in a bubble? could be.
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Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #34 on: October 07, 2015, 11:10:31 AM »
Yeah, you're right.  You may not be able to tell, but you'll "know".  It seems like every time I get pulled over I get asked if I'm on the job.

Goes to show we all profile.  No amount of PC crap is going to keep human nature from making assumptions.  Its part of our survival matrix.

Heck, I as accused of that before I was LEO. Learned from my father, just sorta happened.

Open carry makes you a target and makes the "unknowing" nervous. Personally I have no issue with it, I do it when camping often.
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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #35 on: October 07, 2015, 11:19:25 AM »
Concur...Makes you a target. Bad guy takes out sheep dog first then feeds at his leisure on the sheep.
Best not to play your hand until the situation develops somewhat. Helps you identify the players, evaluate the situation and plan your next move(s)
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #36 on: October 07, 2015, 01:21:42 PM »
Wouldn't open carry deter in most cases, to start with?
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #37 on: October 07, 2015, 03:25:28 PM »

Concur...Makes you a target. Bad guy takes out sheep dog first then feeds at his leisure on the sheep.
Best not to play your hand until the situation develops somewhat. Helps you identify the players, evaluate the situation and plan your next move(s)

Agreed. Never ask a question you don't already know the answer to in a business negotiation  And never give away any type of tactical advantage in life.

Ken. You have thugs stalking and killing cops in uniform. How much of a deterrent was that?


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Offline KensAuto

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #38 on: October 07, 2015, 03:50:33 PM »
I don't open carry for one. Just curious about everyone's views.The main reason I don't is basically to keep from creating discomfort among strangers. I guess I actually care about other's feelings....must be going soft.
2. Thugs Hate cops. Yes, hate, to the point of some actually hunting our friends in blue. They may prey on the weak, but pretty sure most don't hate their prey. Not a psycholigist tho (that's my wifes job), so that comment means absolutely nothing.



I retract my first statement. I do open carry every time I'm in the woods.
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Offline Dawg25385

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #39 on: October 08, 2015, 06:36:00 AM »
I did a nice write up on the crossbreed super tucks... Those of you interested in a comfortable IWB option should check it out. I have one for my G19 and XDS and love em


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Offline Flyin6

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #40 on: October 08, 2015, 09:23:17 AM »
I did a nice write up on the crossbreed super tucks... Those of you interested in a comfortable IWB option should check it out. I have one for my G19 and XDS and love em


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OK, crossbreed...
Take a look
If it will absorb a G19/23 that would be great!
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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #41 on: October 08, 2015, 10:06:22 AM »
I have checked it out but not pulled the trigger.  They are made model specific.
Matt
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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #42 on: October 08, 2015, 11:39:19 AM »
I rarely carry...I see very little need for it on a day to day basis. I am sure this may have much to do with my location as personal preference.

The discussion on profile was interesting...I often wonder how people profile me.


Offline JR

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Re: My Crapper Perspective, Our response to violence
« Reply #43 on: October 08, 2015, 02:57:13 PM »
Norm, I think where you live and how you live and how you asses others come into play.

Not making yourself a target and awareness plays a key roll in all this.

One reason I am very wary is my wife has no clue on what happens around here. It is changing a little with her job now and she understands more, but not enough. She loves anything FREE (like someone doesn't pay for it) and big public gatherings with crowds. I don't like either. 
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