Sending a young man off

[Flyin6]

I find it odd the gov hasn’t got anything newer then either of those two guns,
1976! That’s old as Don!


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Not nearly as old...unfortunately, says the man with the worldly voice. (While the Christian man says, "Yippee, closer to meeting Jesus...Finally!)

The M240 is a great gun...Period!

I was in the Army when we first converted our armored vehicles from a M-219 or a M-73, 7.62 gun to the M240. All I can say is from my experience, that Belgium gun really works. Gone were the constant jams and feeding issues. I would fill the ammo can in a M-60 with 2,200 rounds, then just run the belt onto the floor for another 2,000 rounds. (Anymore, and the loader wouldn't have any room left to sling rounds into that hungry 105mm cannon.) I have fired the barrels off more than one of those guns.

As a helo pilot, my gunners used M240's for a couple of decades. I recall very few jams, except for one very memorable one when a Panamanian was shooting a .50 cal at us and Manny got off exactly one round to suppress him while we maneuvered away. That's the "Lucky-Dollar" story in the book.

Now in Baghdad, the gunners would go to the M249 for suppression if we were getting really engaged. A quick pull of that trigger and 100 rounds were flying everywhere. It's a pretty good gun.

You keep what works and Machine guns do not need to get automated or improved, they just need to work all the time.

[cj7ox]

I find it odd the gov hasn’t got anything newer then either of those two guns,
1976! That’s old as Don!


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The Ma Deuce is still in use, continuously since 1917. ;-)

[Bob Smith]

Keep and use the proven stuff and add the newer stuff. Right Ken?

[KensAuto]

Keep and use the proven stuff and add the newer stuff. Right Ken?

I will defer to the guys that have been there and done that when it comes to powpows!... but I assume you mean other things.

[TexasRedNeck]

I think he means those outdated overpriced inaccurate unreliable hammers you love…

(Shots fired - literally)


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[KensAuto]

I think he means those outdated overpriced inaccurate unreliable hammers you love…

(Shots fired - literally)


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What do you mean inaccurate!!

[Bob Smith]

I think he means those outdated overpriced inaccurate unreliable hammers you love…

(Shots fired - literally)


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Thanks Charles. Don't agree on your description however

[cj7ox]

I think he means those outdated overpriced inaccurate unreliable hammers you love…

(Shots fired - literally)


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John Moses Browning was a genius. The 1911 design proves that. Been around for over 100 years, and still the go-to combat pistol for a lot of trigger pullers on the pointy end of the spear. You Glock guys are just like cross-fitters. SMH

[EL TATE]

I think he means those outdated overpriced inaccurate unreliable hammers you love…

(Shots fired - literally)


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John Moses Browning was a genius. The 1911 design proves that. Been around for over 100 years, and still the go-to combat pistol for a lot of trigger pullers on the pointy end of the spear. You Glock guys are just like cross-fitters. SMH

plus they're just bada$$. "here come the good guys"

[TexasRedNeck]

Lol i knew that would stir the pot….

accurate or reliable, choose one when choosing a 1911….

sloppy was reliable, and tight was accurate.  Of course Ive never thrown a $3500 custom 1911 in the mud and stomped on it to verify….

But i have done that with glocks….


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[Nate]

I think he means those outdated overpriced inaccurate unreliable hammers you love…

(Shots fired - literally)


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John Moses Browning was a genius. The 1911 design proves that. Been around for over 100 years, and still the go-to combat pistol for a lot of trigger pullers on the pointy end of the spear. You Glock guys are just like cross-fitters. SMH

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[KensAuto]

I knew I had some backup somewhere, just took them long enough to get here!!

[cj7ox]

Lol i knew that would stir the pot….

accurate or reliable, choose one when choosing a 1911….

sloppy was reliable, and tight was accurate.  Of course Ive never thrown a $3500 custom 1911 in the mud and stomped on it to verify….

But i have done that with glocks….


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I've got a couple that are "sloppy", that are plenty accurate (I used to be able to have 5 hole touching at 20yd). Funny thing is, that performance could never be repeated from a bench rest. Then again, you won't be using a bench rest in a "shoot the bad guy before he shoots me" situation. Never had a reliability issue with them either. ;-)

I've also owned Glocks, I like them. Good pistol. I just prefer my 1911.

[EL TATE]

If it's good enough for a dude named Basil, it's good enough for me

[TexasRedNeck]

God, how I love to stir this pot. :evil

It’s so much fun.  In the end its what you practice with.

But I will say I’ve never been beat in a pistol match by a 1911…..

Here we go….again


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[KensAuto]

God, how I love to stir this pot. :evil

It’s so much fun.  In the end its what you practice with.

But I will say I’ve never been beat in a pistol match by a 1911…..

Here we go….again


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Nope, not going to do it... nope, just no

[cj7ox]

God, how I love to stir this pot. :evil

It’s so much fun.  In the end its what you practice with.

But I will say I’ve never been beat in a pistol match by a 1911…..

Here we go….again


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That just tells me the caliber of competitors you've been facing. ;-)

[Bigdave_185]

God, how I love to stir this pot. :evil

It’s so much fun.  In the end its what you practice with.

But I will say I’ve never been beat in a pistol match by a 1911…..

Here we go….again


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That just tells me the caliber of competitors you've been facing. ;-)

Shots fired ol son!!


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[TexasRedNeck]

God, how I love to stir this pot. :evil

It’s so much fun.  In the end its what you practice with.

But I will say I’ve never been beat in a pistol match by a 1911…..

Here we go….again


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That just tells me the caliber of competitors you've been facing. ;-)

Well played, sir, well played.


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[oklawall]

just to try and get this back about a young man. What is the current issued side arm of the Army?

[dave945]

I’m the Air Force we were issued both left and right side arms. Just another reason we’re better.

It wasn’t just one or the other.

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[stlaser]

God, how I love to stir this pot. :evil

It’s so much fun.  In the end its what you practice with.

But I will say I’ve never been beat in a pistol match by a 1911…..

Here we go….again


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Unless he was trying to hit you in the head with that hammer…..

Regardless, I’m pretty sure Ken gets beat daily by H!

[wilsonphil]

God, how I love to stir this pot. :evil

It’s so much fun.  In the end its what you practice with.

But I will say I’ve never been beat in a pistol match by a 1911…..

Here we go….again


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Now TNR when your competing in the cowboy action league in the Eastwood age division im sure your doing very well.

AND in Kens defense when your used to shooting at "H" sized targets its hard to miss, so I'm sure he thinks that 1911 is the best thing ever.

Don I apologize for everyone for totally DOT this great thread.

 

[Flyin6]

just to try and get this back about a young man. What is the current issued side arm of the Army?

Currently transitioning to the Sig P320

[Flyin6]

I’m the Air Force we were issued both left and right side arms. Just another reason we’re better.

It wasn’t just one or the other.

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Anybody else want this guy silenced?
I can do it pdq...
;-)


And all of U'2: Quit messin' up my thread!

[EL TATE]

just to try and get this back about a young man. What is the current issued side arm of the Army?

Currently transitioning to the Sig P320

Gotta say i'm a big fan of these. curious to hear what your boy thinks in more than range situations. Hopefully he doesn't have to find out for a long time...

[Nate]

just to try and get this back about a young man. What is the current issued side arm of the Army?

Currently transitioning to the Sig P320

Gotta say i'm a big fan of these. curious to hear what your boy thinks in more than range situations. Hopefully he doesn't have to find out for a long time...

his rank and duty position does not qualify him to carry a pistol.

the sig P320 is the civilian version of the M17 pistol

[Flyin6]

just to try and get this back about a young man. What is the current issued side arm of the Army?

Currently transitioning to the Sig P320

Gotta say i'm a big fan of these. curious to hear what your boy thinks in more than range situations. Hopefully he doesn't have to find out for a long time...

his rank and duty position does not qualify him to carry a pistol.

the sig P320 is the civilian version of the M17 pistol

I want to agree with Nate. I always see him with either a M4 or a M249 SAW, no pistol

[cj7ox]

Yeah. In his unit, only officers will typically be issued a pistol. Usually Commanders, and staff officers.

[Atkinsmatt]

Just found this link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_W8gyUAe-aI

[Flyin6]

So, without getting too deep into it, world events some months ago changed this young soldier's course. We got to see him and watch the Superbowl game together in the guesthouse at Ft Stewart. But he was on alert for a rapid deployment and not long thereafter boarded a jet.
He and his unit landed in a foreign country where he all of them had to draw equipment. Everything from personal items up to and including Abrams tanks. That poor kid has been in the field or on a range almost constantly since leaving. He has only had a handful of actual days off and with that time hasn't been able to get off post where they are except for one day.
One day away from the Army in all this time! Think about it, Think about just how much these soldiers give up. Well, I'd say nearly their entire lives. The Army is gracious enough to give them some sleep, but I suppose that is necessary.
It's been a long time since I was a junior enlisted guy and I suppose you tend to forget the hard stuff, but I am reliving it again through him.
I got two messages on my phone in the past week. The first was "We're going to the field for 30 days." That's it, nothing more. I texted and called but, nothing. Then yesterday I get another message, "We're here."
I gotta say, this being a parent of a deployed soldier really sucks. That poor boy of mine has worked his a$$ off since joining. He has been in the field or on a range more days in the past year than he has been in a barracks. He sleeps in a bedroll on the ground. If it's raining, he is wet. If it is snowing and raining, he is cold and wet, for days at a time. He is as skinny as a freaking rail.
I guess I must have forgotten just how tough it was, but man, could we give the kid a freakin' break already!

[TexasRedNeck]

Meanwhile his peer group back in the states… What?! No freaking Starbucks! What will I do without my latte? And the Internet here sucks! I haven’t been able to see my girlfriend/boyfriend/other in three whole days!


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[Flyin6]

Meanwhile his peer group back in the states… What?! No freaking Starbucks! What will I do without my latte? And the Internet here sucks! I haven’t been able to see my girlfriend/boyfriend/other in three whole days!


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Yea, there's that too
Biggest and most consequential word of all: Choices

[BobbyB]

He has been in the field or on a range more days in the past year than he has been in a barracks. He sleeps in a bedroll on the ground. If it's raining, he is wet. If it is snowing and raining, he is cold and wet, for days at a time. He is as skinny as a freaking rail.
I guess I must have forgotten just how tough it was, but man, could we give the kid a freakin' break already!

He's living the life of the infantryman. You adapt to it or let it beat you up. He'll be fine. 

[Flyin6]

He has been in the field or on a range more days in the past year than he has been in a barracks. He sleeps in a bedroll on the ground. If it's raining, he is wet. If it is snowing and raining, he is cold and wet, for days at a time. He is as skinny as a freaking rail.
I guess I must have forgotten just how tough it was, but man, could we give the kid a freakin' break already!

He's living the life of the infantryman. You adapt to it or let it beat you up. He'll be fine. 

I understand. And I was a Tanker. Not as tough, we had a tank to "Sleep" in but the maintenance of that thing...
And I ran with the Rangers, Seals, green berets and others for many years, so I have seen all that.
But
During no time in my experience was I ever the dad, watching my son go through all that
and
I trust the NCO's out there, so I know in the end he will be fine.

[BobbyB]

I understand. And I was a Tanker. Not as tough, we had a tank to "Sleep" in but the maintenance of that thing...
And I ran with the Rangers, Seals, green berets and others for many years, so I have seen all that.
But
During no time in my experience was I ever the dad, watching my son go through all that
and
I trust the NCO's out there, so I know in the end he will be fine.

I didn't mean what I said to sound as if it was minimizing the Father caring for his son aspect. I have learned that a lot of what I say gets misconstrued by people at work, generally due to how I speak. I meant it as he'll be fine going through all this fun stuff.

[Flyin6]

I understand. And I was a Tanker. Not as tough, we had a tank to "Sleep" in but the maintenance of that thing...
And I ran with the Rangers, Seals, green berets and others for many years, so I have seen all that.
But
During no time in my experience was I ever the dad, watching my son go through all that
and
I trust the NCO's out there, so I know in the end he will be fine.

I didn't mean what I said to sound as if it was minimizing the Father caring for his son aspect. I have learned that a lot of what I say gets misconstrued by people at work, generally due to how I speak. I meant it as he'll be fine going through all this fun stuff.

Couple things:
1. I Didn't take it that way
2. I talk the same way. True soldiers all do
3. I know you and I know your "kind"...same as the special ops dirt grinders I served with
so, I get what you're saying
oh, and I didn't take it that way   ;-)

[oklawall]

Total understand the dad aspect and have seen the mom side also. Two sides of the world between being the one going down range and the one staying behind. Tammy and I spend more time praying and worrying about out military men and women now. Boss I know that it will bring some comfort but won't relieve the worry and concern that a parent has for their child but Tammy and have you, Kate and Nate along with the rest of our military at the top of our prayer list.

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[cj7ox]

Any update on your young crunchy...I mean infantryman? Has he found a Polish bride yet?

[Flyin6]

Any update on your young crunchy...I mean infantryman? Has he found a Polish bride yet?

Poor kid has been in the field, training, for 2 weeks. Has another 2.5 weeks to go before he finishes.
That's all they do is training followed by training, then more training with a forecast of additional training. Easy to see how they are so eager to kill something once we cut them loose!

[cj7ox]

Any update on your young crunchy...I mean infantryman? Has he found a Polish bride yet?

Poor kid has been in the field, training, for 2 weeks. Has another 2.5 weeks to go before he finishes.
That's all they do is training followed by training, then more training with a forecast of additional training. Easy to see how they are so eager to kill something once we cut them loose!

That's good! Makes him proficient. ;-)

[Flyin6]

Radar contact!

Got a call. He's finally back in from that big training op, followed by something they did. They did some good team training with Italians, Bosnians, and two other countries' soldiers. The US SF, 10th group acted as aggressors and unfortunately made quick work of my boy twice. He spent a good amount of time as a "Casualty," but that, was, at least, dry.

Lessons were learned and new acquaintances were made

Something he said which rubbed me wrong: He mentioned they may be getting "Deployment patches out of this. First off, they're not called deployment patches, they're called "Combat patches." Second, if there weren't bullets and bombs being tossed about, then combat did not take place.

I kind of withheld my opinion, but that's as wrong as two guys marrying! Wait, no...

He said he disagreed and said he wouldn't wear it. I don't know what to tell him to do right there. I see it the same as giving everyone at a sporting event a trophy. That was wrong but look at where its come to. I know guys who had it really hard, actually in combat. To give men who were a couple of hundred miles away from the fighting combat patches is pretty unfair to those of us who really were in combat. JMO

[EL TATE]

"combat patches/trophies" "deployment patches/participation awards". less and less like your army huh chief.

[Flyin6]

"combat patches/trophies" "deployment patches/participation awards". less and less like your army huh chief.

The differences are becoming striking!

[Atkinsmatt]

Wait til you see females with their hair down in uniform.  guys with  facial hair.  I know I had to learn the definition of uniform.  I also wonder who the rocket scientist is that approved the new pt gear to be all black and then require everyone to wear a reflective belt.  Among a couple of quick observations.

[Flyin6]

Wait til you see females with their hair down in uniform.  guys with  facial hair.  I know I had to learn the definition of uniform.  I also wonder who the rocket scientist is that approved the new pt gear to be all black and then require everyone to wear a reflective belt.  Among a couple of quick observations.

I see it in the lack of discipline and the fighting spirit is gone. These people move more like conditioned robots who are afraid of their shadow.
Nate tells me guys get turned in all the time for harassment.
WHAT???
That's all soldiers ever do to each other
Builds character!

[oklawall]

Wait til you see females with their hair down in uniform.  guys with  facial hair.  I know I had to learn the definition of uniform.  I also wonder who the rocket scientist is that approved the new pt gear to be all black and then require everyone to wear a reflective belt.  Among a couple of quick observations.

I see it in the lack of discipline and the fighting spirit is gone. These people move more like conditioned robots who are afraid of their shadow.
Nate tells me guys get turned in all the time for harassment.
WHAT???
That's all soldiers ever do to each other
Builds character!

Even as a civilian I have to spend way to many hours away from doing my normal job to learn about diversity and inclusion

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[Flyin6]

He just participated in and won the "Norwegian Ruck March Award"

The march began at 0400 this morning in Germany. Nate was amongst those in the 1st Brigade, 3rd Infantry Division who made it.

The Norwegian military sponsors it and is both present and certifies a soldier's participation.

What's cool about this is that the Norwegians were Vikings, and Nate has a fascination with the Vikings of old.

Congrats son!

The Norwegian ruck march is a Norwegian armed forces skill badge which is earned when participants complete an 18.6 miles (30km) ruck carrying 25 pounds in their rucksacks. Participants receive a foreign military “Marsjmerket” badge upon completion. The general rule is that Men must complete the Norwegian ruck march in 4 hours and 30 minutes

[oklawall]

Good job nate

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[TexasRedNeck]

Well done!


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