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Offline KensAuto

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Cerakote Coated Guns
« on: December 15, 2015, 09:24:44 AM »
I've never "painted" a gun before, but fixin' to try it out. My favorite pistol happens to be a 1911 commander series 80 in stainless. This is the pistol I carry while hunting in mountain lion country, and areas near the southern border of the good ole U.S., but it's very reflective. Time to tone it down.

We'll be using the C series Cerakote, which is the air dry version. It's slower...taking 5 days to fully cure, but supposed to be tough as nails.
The H series is an epoxy style coating that has to be baked. I chose the air dry version mainly because there's no mixing. Since hardener doesn't have to be added, you can return any unused coating back into the jug, so no waste. This stuff is expensive and I don't want to waste any. The C coating is also rated for higher temps....1200*f...not that my gun will ever see those temps.

..partial tear down:






...she's seen better days.



« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 10:21:26 AM by KensAuto »
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2015, 09:26:20 AM »
Couldn't decide on color, so I ordered 4.
Magpul O.D. Green,
Magpul Flat Dark Earth,
Coyote Tan,
and Graphite Black



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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2015, 09:33:03 AM »
It's hard to tell in the pics, but the beavertail safety was beat up pretty bad, literally. It look like someone took a hammer to it. After trying to straighten it out, and filing, and sanding, I tossed it and purchased a new wilson combat version, with the "hump". The hump allows a guy with a bad hand, or wearing gloves, to engage the safety easily:



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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2015, 09:36:26 AM »
Next up was the trigger. Someone had added a "shoe" to it, which adds width to the plastic, thin, trigger. This is also a Wilson:









« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 10:25:53 PM by KensAuto »
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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2015, 09:40:12 AM »
....purchased an extended slide release while I was at it:





...and some new grips. I may not use these on this gun....the original "pachmeyer" style colt wrap arounds may go back on. I really liked the way the wood felt, and they are different (I like different), but I didn't shoot as well with them.



« Last Edit: December 27, 2015, 08:49:51 PM by KensAuto »
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2015, 09:44:45 AM »
Next up was to fit the new "drop in" beavertail safety and the trigger. Yeah, drop in they say.....NOT!
Completely reassembled the gun, used a pencil to make sure the firing pin fired (series 80s have extra little safety goodies that some guys remove and they are a pain to reinstall!), and then disassemble again. I deburred all of the sharp edges, and now it's time to do a final clean. After that comes the sandblasting.
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2015, 09:54:14 AM »
This is Cerakote's instructions for using the air dried coating:

C-Series Ambient Cure Ceramic Firearm Coatings
Preparation of substrate is crucial for maximum adhesion and performance of this material
1.) Completely disassemble the firearm. Detail strip your firearm. If you are unfamiliar with this level of disassembly, have a certified gunsmith perform the disassembly and reassembly. If pins or parts are left in, they can produce runs and ruin the finish. Take a photograph of all the parts received. Make note of the substrate type on each piece (i.e. Steel, Aluminum, plastic, composite, polymer, etc.)

2.) Soak each part for 10-15 minutes in a non-water based degreaser such as Brake-Kleen® or acetone. Spraying is not sufficient; soaking is required. Allow parts to air dry after soaking. From this point on it is critical to avoid touching the parts with your bare hands. Use powder-free latex style gloves to handle the parts. In most cases it is not necessary or recommended to soak plastic and polymer parts in a solvent based degreaser as to avoid damaging the part. Thoroughly wiping plastic and polymer parts with a compatible degreasing solvent is sufficient.

3.) Begin surface preparation by plugging the bore at both the chamber and the muzzle end of the barrel prior to blasting. Grit blast the parts with #100 to #120 grit aluminum oxide or garnet sand at 80 to 100 psi. Strive for an even blast pattern over the surface of the parts. Lightly blast (30-40 psi) non-metal parts such as: wood, fiberglass, plastic and polymer. Hard anodizing does not need to be removed if it withstands 3-5 seconds of blasting at normal blast pressure (80-100 psi) in one location without coming off the part.
TIPS: If the part’s surface is still shiny after blasting, you haven’t blasted enough. If you use too coarse of grit, the microscopic valleys on the part’s surface will be too deep for the 1.0 mil (.001”) coating to completely fill while covering the corresponding “peaks” sufficiently to assure a satisfactory coating. Don’t use sand that has been previously used to clean dirty, greasy, or oily parts. Doing so will contaminate your parts. When blasting hard anodizing or delicate substrates such as plastics, polymers, wood, fiberglass, be sure to be 8-10” away and lightly etch the part only to remove the sheen and to avoid an over aggressive blast profile. If you use #120 grit, be sure the grit does not wear out as you are using it. #120 is pretty fine at the start and will wear to an ineffective dust. DO NOT use any type of round blasting media such as glass beads or steel shot. Round media will dimple the surface rather than etching it, and will not yield a sufficient blast profile for optimum coating adhesion.

4.) Hang parts to allow for best view and application access. This can be done by using support wires or hooks. Make sure to place parts in such a way that they will not bump into each other. Do not touch parts with bare skin. Alligator clips or 30-gauge wire are recommended for small parts such as screws and springs.

5.) After parts are racked, heat metal parts in the oven at 300 degrees Fahrenheit (F) for 60 minutes to drive off any remaining solvents or contaminants. Remove the parts from the oven and allow them to cool. If you see any oil residue or other indication that oil was driven out of the part, re-clean by soaking in the degrease tank and reheat for an additional thirty minutes. Any contamination from this point onward will result in a less than satisfactory finish. Be careful, and take your time. If further degreasing is required, repeat as necessary until no oil residue is visible. CAUTION: Plastic and polymer parts should be gassed-out at a lower temperature. Gassing-out non-metallic parts can be done at the same temperature they are cured at. Refer to the cure schedule table on pg. 18 for these temperatures. If you are unsure as to the temperature stability of your parts, contact the manufacturer prior to gassing-out and curing non-metallic parts.

6.) Shake the C-Series product until the coating is completely mixed and no solids remain in the bottom of the container. Failure to completely disperse the product will result in poor chemical ratios and product failure. DO NOT MIX WITH H-SERIES CATALYST OR COATINGS.

7.) Blow off the substrate with a high-pressure air nozzle to remove any blasting dust left on the surface. Wear safety goggles or face shield for your protection. Work in a well-ventilated area. If ventilation is not available, wear a respirator - see MSDS for additional information.

8.) Recommended spray equipment is an HVLP gun with a metal cup and point-8 millimeter tip. The use of a small spray tip pattern will aid in coating hard to reach areas without excessive build up in surrounding areas. Electrostatic application may also be an option. Material does not need to be thinned. Use as received.

9.) A single application of product at 20 psi is recommended for a 0.5 to 1.0 mil film thickness. Work from the most difficult surface out to the easiest. This will aid in reducing runs or excessive build up.

10.) Allow to air-dry. Parts will be tack free after approximately 35 minutes. Until this point the coating is still wet, so take care to not bump or touch the parts. Parts will be partially cured after 24 hours and fully cured 5 days after application.

11.) Finished goods may be shipped after 24 hours when the coating is partially cured.

12.) Clean tools and equipment with acetone or Cerakote® cleaning solvent
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2015, 10:22:57 AM »
I had to change out the glass bead media for some 120 grit aluminum oxide, per cerakote's instructions. They say that the glass beads leave small indentations that the coating will not fill evenly. The coating goes on very thin....  .5-1.0 mils. That's another reason I chose Cera over other brands like Dura. I won't have to worry about accidently coating parts like the slide contact surface, trigger, etc.

Out with the old glass media and in with aluminum oxide:





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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2015, 10:35:15 AM »
...using brake clean to clean the parts. From this stage forward, you have to wear non-powdered gloves to keep oil from contaminating the pieces. (one of the downsides to coating something without first applying some type of primer)



....the parts that will recieve some amount of coating:


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Offline rasimmo

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2015, 12:10:53 PM »
This looks real interesting. I have been looking into the stuff required to do the bake on.

Offline stlaser

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2015, 11:39:39 PM »
Ken, I'm following this as well to see how it turns out for you.....
Living in the remote north hoping Ken doesn’t bring H up here any time soon…..

Offline BobbyB

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2015, 02:51:08 AM »
Couldn't decide on color, so I ordered 4.
Magpul O.D. Green,
Magpul Flat Dark Earth,
Coyote Tan,
and Graphite Black


So are all of these colors making an appearance on the 1911?
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!
your standard grunt level CQB is just putting rounds and rounds on scary stuff till it stops scaring you!

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2015, 09:51:26 AM »
I think this one will get the coyote tan, with black accents...trigger, hammer, and part of the barrel. If it works out, and is as durable as they say, I'll move on to the AR, and then the other 1911, then maybe the 300 weatherby. The other 1911 is a long barrel Argentine version and I'm thinkin' OD green for that one.
Thinkin FDE on the AR since it will match most of magpul's accessories.....if I upgrade anything. Just wish i had more time at the shop for toys....we're slammed right now.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 10:28:38 PM by KensAuto »
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Offline stlaser

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2015, 10:28:21 AM »
Ken, that's a good problem to have.....

Was gunna make a Hillary comment but I held my tongue! ;D
Living in the remote north hoping Ken doesn’t bring H up here any time soon…..

Offline BobbyB

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2015, 10:41:05 AM »
I think this one will get the coyote tan, with black accents...trigger, hammer, and part of the barrel. If it works out, and is as durable as they say, I'll move on to the AR, and then the other 1911, then maybe the 300 weatherby. The other 1911 is a long barrel Austrian version and I'm thinkin' OD green for that one.
Thinkin FDE on the AR since it will match most of magpul's accessories.....if I upgrade anything. Just wish i had more time at the shop for toys....we're slammed right now.

Got ya.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!
your standard grunt level CQB is just putting rounds and rounds on scary stuff till it stops scaring you!

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #15 on: December 24, 2015, 03:01:25 PM »
Made the wife mad. Told her I was closing up today, for Christmas Eve. She assumed it was to spend time with the girls, but I had the 1911 on my mind....I mean, after all, IT is my #1 gun and i feel naked without it.
First off, I recleaned all of the parts. Sandblasted them, and hung them on some homemade racks (took a torch to some old oven racks). From this point forward I will not touch the parts without rubber gloves, untill they are coated and dry.

I then reblasted them after finding traces of grease on them, from the bead blaster gloves (I told the employee to never put greasy parts in there....uuurrrrrr!!!!!!)
After cleaning for the 1700th time, they went in the oven at 300* for 1 hour.

These will get the C-240 Desert Tan:




...and these will be C-102 Graphite Black:




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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #16 on: December 24, 2015, 03:08:24 PM »
...about 5 minutes in, I heard what sounded like a mini explosion going off. It appears as though, I pulled another Ken.......

the mainspring housing came apart, shooting the pin towards the oven door glass, but missing by a fraction...thank goodness! (I left it assembled so that it would be one less assembly step, and one less chance of scratching the coating during assembly)

I (Ken :( ) did not know that the housing was polymer (read:plastic) and is not rated for 300*f...at least the one I have isn't.
I really thought it was aluminum. uurrrrrr

The new one WILL be metal:
« Last Edit: December 24, 2015, 09:43:48 PM by KensAuto »
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #17 on: December 24, 2015, 03:10:02 PM »
That will be it for today. I'm going to try and spray everything Saturday.
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Offline Sammconn

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #18 on: December 24, 2015, 09:04:18 PM »
Well that sounds like my kind of luck.
At least it didn't take out the oven glass!

Looking foreword to how this all works out.
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #19 on: December 27, 2015, 05:56:54 PM »
I decided to rob the mainspring from my backup gun. It's a government model, but has the same mainspring, but made out of steel, and has the palm hump and a lanyard.
It was cleaned and blasted:
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #20 on: December 27, 2015, 06:03:01 PM »
It was very windy Saturday....of course....the day I had planned on spraying. I made a visit to the shop, loaded up gun parts and supplies, then plastic wrapped the inside of my shed/reloading room. This, in theory, would be a dust free zone, albeit claustrophobic and non-ventilated.



This seemed to help little:

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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #21 on: December 27, 2015, 06:09:48 PM »
Let me tell you, that is some of the nastiest paint/chemicals I have ever inhaled. I mean it will absolutely ruin brain cells!!! It was bad with the mask, so don't EVER try to spray that stuff without one, period!!

I brought the parts in to the warmth of the house, hoping that it would cure enough for assembly today (they say that after 24 hrs, it's good enough for shipping)
side note: I brought them indoors after about 2 hrs, and they didn't smell, and the 2 parts that had runs, the trigger and hammer, didn't have runs anymore. Weird stuff.....


« Last Edit: December 27, 2015, 06:10:26 PM by KensAuto »
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #22 on: December 27, 2015, 06:17:36 PM »
By this morning, the parts were fairly scratch resistant....amazing. I went ahead with assembly:



...although the runs were gone, the thickness of the coating was way to thick. Cerakote says .5-1 mils (.005-.001 thousands) and I had about 3 inches on the slide and trigger !!!
I intentionally didn't tape off the slide because it had a fair amount of play, but it was still too thick so I had to break out the sandpaper.

...also decided to remove the secondary safety system that the 80 series are know for. This gives the trigger a crisper feel.
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #23 on: December 27, 2015, 06:23:36 PM »
Enough chatter, here's the final product. I'm going to shoot both styles of grips and pick the best.

Indoors, it sometimes looks green, outdoors brownish green, and against a green bush, it looks tan....it's supposed to be Coyote Tan:







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Offline stlaser

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #24 on: December 27, 2015, 07:14:23 PM »
Not too shabby!
Living in the remote north hoping Ken doesn’t bring H up here any time soon…..

Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #25 on: December 27, 2015, 07:46:51 PM »
Nice Ken, why do you suppose it went on so thick?
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #26 on: December 27, 2015, 08:46:37 PM »
Not too shabby!
Thank you sir.

Tex, it was me....all me. lol

By the time I was done with the first coat, my glasses were fogged tan as well. That was a very small work space, and not very bright. I was trying to use a small flashlight to cut down on shadows, etc. I'm sure I can find more excuses.
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Offline rasimmo

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #27 on: December 27, 2015, 08:55:15 PM »
That looks real good from here boss. Nice job. I'm sure, like most of us, you are your own worst critic.

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #28 on: December 27, 2015, 09:01:34 PM »
Thanks. I know it's not rocket science, but since it is different than paint, I wasn't quite sure how it layed down. Now I do so it's time to do a long gun....especially since I read yesterday, that cera has a shelf life of only 6 months.....and I bought enough to do 12,000 guns!
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Offline rasimmo

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #29 on: December 27, 2015, 09:13:24 PM »
I have read the bake on stuff has shelf life of about 1 year after opening. It kinda makes sense that the air dry would be shorter. I would like to do a couple 4 or 5 color camo pattern rifles. The smallest bottle is 4 ounces, so like you I would have inough for a small armory ow weapons. Might have to get a few guys together and do a bunch after I play with it a little.

Offline Flyin6

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #30 on: December 27, 2015, 11:10:23 PM »
Purdy!

You drop that thing out there and it's a gonner!
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #31 on: December 28, 2015, 01:56:45 AM »
Looks nice.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!
your standard grunt level CQB is just putting rounds and rounds on scary stuff till it stops scaring you!

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #32 on: December 28, 2015, 09:23:34 AM »
Thanks guys.  Don,  I may be a klutz but I don't drop guns!




...if only that was true. ...

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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #33 on: January 01, 2016, 07:54:35 PM »
Finally ran the gun today,  100 rounds without incident.  Trigger is mucho better without the extra safety.  Not going to quit my day job yet, but definitely going to paint some more guns from the safe.
Goofy pic with my daughter :

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Offline stlaser

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #34 on: January 01, 2016, 09:05:17 PM »
Well you doing this has inspired me to try it out on some AR's this spring. Guess I better get that air compressor built....
Living in the remote north hoping Ken doesn’t bring H up here any time soon…..

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #35 on: January 06, 2016, 05:39:58 PM »
Finally got some sights , which are fun to install on a Colt. I shoot it pretty good without sights....actually thought about leaving them off....but wanted to have a way to chamber a round with one hand.
Here's the night time Trijicon HDs with yellow front sight:



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Offline wilsonphil

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #36 on: January 06, 2016, 06:06:49 PM »
That's what Kimber is doing on some of the Ultra Carry models now, they just have a groove down the middle of the slide.

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote for the 1911
« Reply #37 on: January 13, 2016, 09:29:17 AM »
I coated my other 45 recently. It's  a tool box gun, and I'm too ashamed to show the before pics....banged up and pretty rusted, it has taken some abuse over the last 25 years.
Magpul OD Green with Magpul F.D.E. accents :




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Offline wilsonphil

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #38 on: January 13, 2016, 10:42:21 AM »
Looks good, did you by chance spray some random samples and do some drop/hammer test to see how durable the coating is?

Offline stlaser

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #39 on: January 13, 2016, 11:02:32 AM »
Rust & guns that must be some liberal idea......
Living in the remote north hoping Ken doesn’t bring H up here any time soon…..

Offline BobbyB

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #40 on: January 13, 2016, 02:21:13 PM »
That looks good as well.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!
your standard grunt level CQB is just putting rounds and rounds on scary stuff till it stops scaring you!

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #41 on: January 13, 2016, 02:30:14 PM »
Thanks guys.
Phil, the answer is no, I didn't. I will say that it's pretty tough, but easily sandable at the 24 hr mark. That last gun, the Argentinian model, was a lot tighter than the Colt, so I ended up sanding off the barrel along with every other contact surface....but even then, it's extremely chemical resistant.
I would say it's pretty tough after a couple weeks, because I've carried the Colt in a plastic hoster a few times hunting, and banged it getting in and out of the ranger, hiking through brush, climbed a mountain and there still isn't any marks....none at all. ...or maybe just lucky and the holster did it's job.
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #42 on: May 13, 2016, 12:24:51 PM »
So hows the finish working out?
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!
your standard grunt level CQB is just putting rounds and rounds on scary stuff till it stops scaring you!

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #43 on: May 13, 2016, 02:14:06 PM »
The tan one is showing some scratches from the crossbreed holster, but not too bad. I don't regret doing it.
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #44 on: May 13, 2016, 06:35:11 PM »
The tan one is showing some scratches from the crossbreed holster, but not too bad. I don't regret doing it.

Normal holster wear? Or the coating not working like it should?
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!
your standard grunt level CQB is just putting rounds and rounds on scary stuff till it stops scaring you!

OldKooT

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #45 on: May 16, 2016, 10:16:22 AM »
Ken.... yah what Bobby said. Is it turning out to be durable enough? I need to do something with a R870 Soon...every time I sneeze it trys to rust. It's about down to bare steel in most places LoL

I have plenty experience around Dura-Coat and I am not thrilled honestly. So this is the next option...that or I will blue it I guess.


Offline KensAuto

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Re: Cerakote Coated Guns
« Reply #46 on: May 16, 2016, 10:43:01 AM »
I don't think it would be considered "normal" wear. The Kydex had some rough edges, but not sharp that I could tell. My old holster (uncle Mikes?) didn't leave any marks on it after hunting with it, so not sure what to think. Maybe the coating wasn't fully cured before switching holsters....or maybe I'm expecting to much....I mean, the scratches can't be seen 20 feet away...

Now it's in the truck. I haven't been wearing it to be truthful.
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