Author Topic: LML Duramax Silverado Build Thread....C-MAX [Part 2-EGR delete and more] (Read 254353 times)

KensAuto · « **Reply #150 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:02:58 PM »

Well, I said I didn't have tire pics to post tonight...the tractor won't start so I have no way of lifting that thing onto the rack, especially considering the little rangers are covered up with homework without a second to spare!

But I didn't say I wouldn't post some pics!
Here's some teaser shots of the experimental T-Rex passenger IC pipe that eliminates the butterfly valve and heater and a bunch of other crap:

Now all I can gurantee is that the pipe will be installed.
I will not gurantee that it will work, however.
Not saying Calvin at T-Rex did anything wrong, just saying that I requested this be done as an experimental design. Seems about two other guys here had the same idea at about the same time and have ordered their own pipes as well. So someone will get one of these pipes bolted on PDQ and get the general civie public some information in the not too distant future

Some more pics:

KensAuto · « **Reply #151 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:07:32 PM »

OK, tonight I can put this project in the can. I test fit, adjusted then mounted the spare, completing the project except for the lisence plate lights which I just acquired.
There was a tad bit of cleaning weld and paint spatter required to get the axle to fit, but it finally got in there. THen I discovered a stock achorn nut would not work with evan a thin wall socket, so I simply welded two lug nuts together to form a long lug nut. You'll see why shortly

I used a little muscle to mount that tire onto the carrier:

The tire wound up sticking too far aft on the initial test fit, so I marked the carrier axle and removed it

Allowing for just 1/2" clearance, the remainder of the shaft was cut off

KensAuto · « **Reply #152 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:12:36 PM »

Sliding the axle home, the fit was right on. I really liked the slight angle of the hub which allows you to rotate it to gain the most clearance.

Looks like the measurement came out about where I expected it to be. This mount will carry a 37 and possibly a 38 in tire.
I haven't figured where to mount the John Deere tractor yet, which is about necessary to get that heavy sucker up onto that mount!

It opens and closes with no complaint. It is all pretty rigid, which is surprising considering the weight which is cantilevered up there.

KensAuto · « **Reply #153 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:14:23 PM »

Some poser shots

KensAuto · « **Reply #154 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:17:38 PM »

KensAuto · « **Reply #155 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:18:21 PM »

Ordered a pair of these mini LED flood/work lights to fit in the recess either side of that new bumper. Plan to wire them to the tail-light circut.
10 watt mini light in a sturdy housing with a 120 degree beam spread.

KensAuto · « **Reply #156 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:26:25 PM »

Update: I plan to do the passenger side IC pipe install tomorrow. I won't be able to evaluate how well it works with snow in the forecast, but at least I should get it on.

Comment by Armalite :
Even admit it yourself. The snow has the truck shut down. Cant even make it to the mall because of the snow...

I thought for sure that this truck could handle a little of the white stuff??

....and by stlaser:
I don't know first gravel covered driveways are an issue and now this....

You know I'm starting to see a trend here. These worrisome thoughts about what his truck could handle terrain wise (or in this case not) didn't really become a major theme until he purchased Big Red. Watch out I think a set of those mattracks are going to be debuting here real soon.... Mattracks | Worldwide Rubber Track Technology Or maybe he'll start fabbing a set of his own, you know he was talking about getting a larger welder just yesterday......

Now that he owns something with tracks I think maybe he's having flashbacks of those days when he drove tanks around? Ashley, we may have discovered a new war syndrome of some sort. Watch out the lefties will be wanting to ban all of these guys from owning vehicles with tracks next. You know those tracked vehicles have been known to start themselves and drive over innocent civies at will (did I just use some of that military lingo? Note to self: gotta stop hanging around all you service members that jargon is addicting! Next thing you know I'll be abbreviating everything!).

Sorry for the rambling, couldn't sleep and this is what you all get!

....and some more ribbing by fellow "DOT" bobbyB:
Oh god no!!! He is going to make an "assault tank" ?, that has to be banned immediately .. its scary..

Flyin6's response:
I like those words
Assault
Tank
Good words to be sure

BTW, I noticed an unused 75mm anti tank gun sitting at the vfw about a mile from big red...

KensAuto · « **Reply #157 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:30:46 PM »

(4372)
OK, enough of this silliness
On to some more modding and generally changing of perfectly good stuff!
With this next set of postings we will look at that crappy passenger IC pipe, all the aluminum stuff that connects to it and unnecessary electrical stuff.

When removing the S&B air cleaner, a quick inspection showed that the filter sock is doing it's job!

did not remove the air cleaner box at this point, but eventually I had to, so if you're doing this project, just pull the box at this time.
After removing the large air cleaner to turbo bellows pipe, you remove the passenger IC plastic pipe. You do this by turning the clocking ring a degree or two then alligator wrestling it off. THe bottom fitting at the intercooler is the same goofy setup.

Next pull the connectors from the butterfly valve and disconnect the cable from the grid heater which will go bye-bye.

KensAuto · « **Reply #158 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:35:16 PM »

I removed the butterfly valve, aluminum "S" tube and mount as one unit. Save the two bolts holding the butterfly valve steel bracket to the alternator housing mount, you'll be needing them in a minute.
With that done the aluminum contraption designed for the orbiter and not trucks comes cleanly out!

In these pics, you can immediately see the tube size is squeezed down significantly. Then the air has to squeeze past that very intrusive and clogging grid heater. Makes you wonder how they got this engine to make 765 torque with all this junk to contend with!

About now the parts on the floor should have hit a high water mark!

The butterfly valve has a second mount which also secures the dip stick. It was all "Too big Lookin" so I pulled it and reduced it's weight some

With that big hole in the top of the motor just waiting to swallow a washer or bolt, I bolted the top half of the new pipe in place with some haste

KensAuto · « **Reply #159 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:38:25 PM »

Then it was time to remove the air cleaner box.
After some study, I noticed there was a cool little piece of sheet metal that came out with the removal of 3 bolts which made access to the IC easy.

With a liberal coating of silicone I slid the first coupler onto the IC nipple.

Examing the T-bolt clamps supplied with the pipes from T-rex, I'd have to recommend not to use them.
Two reasons
1. They are a siny bit on the small side necessitating way too much effort to get the nut installed,
2. The supplied clamps have coarse thread, therefore not aircraft quality.
So I'd recommend you spring for a clamp with about a 3.30" max opening with fine thread.
I use turbonetics clamps which slipped right on with no fuss at all. Further the fine thread will give you a lot more clamping force if you are the over tightening type. The nice part is that fine thread allows you to sneak up on tight without coming up against all at once.

KensAuto · « **Reply #160 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:44:00 PM »

After liberally coating the upper pipe with silicone, I slid the boot all the way on and past the bead.

Here's a side by side of the stocker and Calvin's piece. THe T-Rex pipe is very obviously smoother and gets rid of that unnecessary "S" turn that has to hurt flow and generally just has less bulk and size.

When I put the pipe on the first time, I found it to be too long by maybe 1/2" so I cut the excess pipe off beyond the bead that is rolled into the pipe. After that it fit, but is touching. I plan to run it like this, then later pull off the upper pipe at some point and shorten that pipe to allow the flex coupling to do it's thing.
After some grinding and polishing, I installed the pipe and tightened the clamps.

I noticed the air box was pulling some debris in throudh the lower hole which I had plugged earlier. SO this time I sealed it with RTV semi permanently.

Then the air box and air pipe was reinstalled which. Prior to that I retaped the electrical power cables back up and secured the several unused plugs.

KensAuto · « **Reply #161 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:45:42 PM »

I then went into the wheel well to button all that up, and that's when I discovered it!
The truck was destroyed!
And I didn't even know it!!!!
Just look at the horrible damage:

Yes, I know, it's awful
It's mud of course and I had no idea the truck was in such bad condition.
Then I checked out the engine and found this:

Yes apparently the engine is destroyed also!
I managed to find a bumper bolt from the one I just pulled off and plugged that hole in the exhaust manifold...Maybe the truck will manage to limp around now, who knows...

Anyway, I buttoned it all up and started it up. I can testify that the engine definitely revs quicker and wants to get to higher RPMs more quicklier.
Any of you who have ever been to the SERE course at Bragg know that word, nuff said...
SO, we have church tonight so I'll see how it runs and report back.

KensAuto · « **Reply #162 on:** November 17, 2014, 10:51:05 PM »

(4393)
I can report that that pipe made a difference.
The EGT's were lower, as in I didn't see anything over the 900's. The caveat is, however that it was snowing lightly and I didn't get in to it all that much. The motor revs quicker and is smoother.
Pulling onto the highway from the onramp the traction light kept coming on with the wet road, when it never did that before. I'd have to say the motor is making more torque than before and it comes on very smoothly. That pipe was definately worth the money!
Hats off to Calvin and his T-Rex "make everything happen" diesel performance shop!

Quote:
Originally Posted by c************
"what were your egts before the ic pipe? i noticed a difference in throttle response in mine also but if its cold outside and your trucks not plugged in it has a hard time starting.. when mine fired up after sitting overnight it stuttered for 5 seconds like it was missing then continued its normal cold start.. i hooked the heater and the butterfly valve back up today and am leaving my truck unplugged tonight to see if it makes it healthy again. even with the stuff in place it made a good diff. calvin is the man. and good write up don"

When I started it in the cold garage, it fired up normally.
It was parked in the lot outside the church for about 2.5 hours last night. It had ice on it. I started it and it fired right up and ran normally, well, actually, it ran more smoothly then when it had that clunky valve.
I still believe the heater is for EGR purposes only and not for cold starting, can someone prove me wrong on this please?
EGT's:
When it was with EGR, I'd see 1300's. With EGR removal, then only 1200's. When I added Ricks manifolds and up pipes, honestly, it seldom gets into the 1100's, mostly stays in the 900-1050 range. Last night while hammering it the little bit I could, I was seeing 700-mid 800's. Maybe I saw a 900 for a flash, don't recall...
If I add the water meth, I can then probably begin using it as a refrigerator!

Quote:
Originally Posted by FC****
"Well at least I wasn't kidding myself when I noticed more response the the power bands. Watch your max boost when you get a chance. With the larger tube I noticed a 4 psi loss. But I did notice and videoed it my egt has dropped on wot runs. Ill make that psi drop up here in a few months. "

Keep in mind PSI is not important, however the volume of air getting to the combustion chamber.
Think about paint guns. The standard high pressure paint gun uses 40-50 psi to forcefully push out that paint. However about 40% of the paint actually bounces off the surface and ends up becoming airborne dust. The newer HVLP (high volume, low pressure, uses half or less the air pressure to spray the same amount of paint. And know what? Because the paint isn't hurling out at mach 3, more of it sticks to the surface. Less pressure, more material moved.

I used to run a buick grand national. Hence the "flyin6" at least part of why that name came about. I mean, sure I was flying for a reason, but the buick would just about fly. The buick had six cylinders, but in the Army the guy in command was often called "six." OK, back to the buicks, built stockers were running 25 psi to get the job done. But guys in the know would concentrate on getting more volume as a much lower pressure to actually make more power. Hey if a caged, framed car weighing 3800 lbs could run in the 10's and still be driven on vacation, there must be something good going on with the concept...

KensAuto · « **Reply #163 on:** November 18, 2014, 10:24:52 PM »

Quote:
Originally Posted by R****
"Looks good...the snorkel seemed to be the only thing missing from an otherwise very capable off-road survival vehicle."

Snorkel would help, but not for the reason you mentioned.
Right now that truck could probably take somewhere from 30"-40" of water with the top of the engine and electrics above the planning water. That would keep the intake dry, still
Getting into water any deeper, and you will lose traction due to flotation, so practically speaking, I think I can do truck right up to the point where I do boat and plug along just fine.
The reason I could use, and brother Ashley absolutely needs a snorkel, is dust and dirt!
I learned this lesson over in the sand pit shooting gallery. The wheels obviously churn up the dust and vorticies circulate it in and around the wheel well. As we know the air intake sits just above all that on the other side of the wheel liner. Eliminates some, but not nearly enough of the dirt, so the air filter becomes the last line of defense.
OK, so if you only positioned the intake a few feet higher, you would have a nearly dust free area from which to draw air. SO that's filter effect #1.
Top the pipe off with a device that causes a strong vortex (swirling) action that ejects particles which have been centrifuged to the outside of the cylindrical device and you have filter effect #2.
Then place the actual intake pipe in the center of all that and you have filter effect #3.
Finally the air is routed to and through the natural filter and bingo, filter #4 and berry, berry kleen air is available for all those compressions to chew on.
So that would be the reason, my learned padawan, for stickin' a kintucky stove pipe up the side and to de top!

Here's a pic of the snorkel I built for my Tundra. That was made from a long section of 3" steel tubing that was cut and sectioned about a hundred times and then filled in with body filler to make it "rounder."

KensAuto · « **Reply #164 on:** November 18, 2014, 10:30:52 PM »

I'm in the middle of relocating the PCV vent from the turbo when this shows up at the door:

Well, after making a straight run at it, I completed the PCV delete.
I vented it to filtered atmosphere to remove any oil residue that could possibly foul the turbo inlet and to get rid of the restriction on the inlet scroll.

I purchased a readily available catch can with vent available from summit designed just for this purpose.

KensAuto · « **Reply #165 on:** November 18, 2014, 10:33:11 PM »

First think I did was paint the parts and cook up some crab cakes. Both turned out fine.

In the middle of painting parts, cooking the cakes, then painting some more, and trying to eat, the neighbor called telling me my dog was digging up her yard. Well you already saw the disaster there. That mutt is still locked in the woman's garage awaiting a fire hose to clean that mud off.

Then I drilled and tapped the can flange for 5/16" X 18

The air intake hose came off next followed by the PCV inlet diffuser valve. Note the "thing" sticking into the air tract creating vortices...naughty...naughty!

KensAuto · « **Reply #166 on:** November 18, 2014, 10:36:13 PM »

(4560)
Hmmm, fuzzy pic...oh well everyone just deal with it, get over the traumatic experience and let's drive on

OK, next the inlet scroll comes out .

KensAuto · « **Reply #167 on:** November 19, 2014, 09:18:37 PM »

Hmmm, another fuzzy pic, starting to stress here, but I'll be fine, I think. Sort of like that hopeless feeling when you get all mired in a mulch bed over at the mall with only kolean kars parked around and their zoned out 16 yr old drivers...Yea bad deal

OK pressing on, Here's some lookie-see shots of that gaudy thing messin with the air molecules in the inlet:

So, I ground all that plastic out of the way, but have no fear I didn't get it all over, just in my eyes.

KensAuto · « **Reply #168 on:** November 19, 2014, 09:20:19 PM »

With the restriction gone I started to have flashbacks from one of the wars I attended, don't remember which one, it's not important, but with that killer face on, I grabbed the hacksaw and took out my frustrations on the PCV valve

didn't like that big hole so much, so I drilled a whole bunch of little holes to keep it company around the inside circumference, then mixed up a batch of resin, taped off one end and poured it full.

KensAuto · « **Reply #169 on:** November 19, 2014, 09:22:45 PM »

While waiting for that to cure, I went to rippin' and tearin' again
Here's that nasty factory PCV hose

And after attaching the new hose, I laid it on the fender and was done!
Engine is now vented to the atmosphere!

That's when I stared out the window, the one that is now useable again since all the parts boxes were used up. I immediately noticed a mud-dauber nest!

Darn, that's right, they build those nests in everything with a hole in it. The way my boys sleep, I wonder if they ever had to pick any out of their, well, never mind.
So with mud daubers in mind, I decided to create something a little fancier for the end of the hose.

There isn't much room under the hood with 400 cubic inches and 8 miles of wires, so I spied an appropriate spot and went to work:

KensAuto · « **Reply #170 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:40:36 PM »

That brace is just too big and taking up space I needed, so we compromised and like a contestant on biggest loser, it lost some bulk

With that piece in place, a short arm to attach to the can was cut out of 11 gage sheet steel.

KensAuto · « **Reply #171 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:43:18 PM »

Next the can assembly, well, became an assembly, after, well, assembly!

Purdy little top had, don't ya think?
Next I did something else:

KensAuto · « **Reply #172 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:45:48 PM »

Next I applied concentrated sparks to it in several different ways

Then some paint to hide the damage

While waiting for the John Deere paint to dry, the intake scroll whtch-ah-ma-kall-it slid back together minus all the vorticie makin' protrusions.

KensAuto · « **Reply #173 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:47:22 PM »

That piece was reinstalled along with the intake hose/pipe thing.

With the paint dry enough to smack it around like my neighbors when they bother me, the whole thing was bolted inplace and the vent line connected. And, yes the hood closes!

So that's one way to delete your PCV, now that we know it's easy, get on it!

KensAuto · « **Reply #174 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:50:16 PM »

Update on the PCV delete mod.
I want to say the truck feels more torquey than before. It just seems to have very good throttle response, and I'm wondering if that is psychological or real. Nailing it it still gets all jiggy and the max EGT I was able to generate on a longer pull was 1153 and only for a second.
It would seem everything you do to this engine to make it breath better results in lower EGT's as well as more oomph.
None of this is verified, of course. But there is no denying the truck does indeed run well.

So, here's what is in store for the truck this coming week. I already ordered some air bag helper springs. I plan to make some custom mounts and get them installed.

I am changing up the shop getting ready for the tactical topper project re-energizing. Today I purchased Harbor freight huge tool boxes and transfered the tools from my hopelessly over packed 40 year old boxes. I will clean them up tomorrow then make hardware storage out of them.

I am pulling the Tundra down into it's component parts, then I will haul the big pieces out and be done with it. If anyone needs a project truck, here's you opportunity to get one cheap. Once that is out of there, I want to do a couple day redesign on that side of the garage, then get the tac-topper torn down ready to go into phase next.

In the middle of all that, I think I'll mount the spare and water cans onto the combat gator. No sooner than the pole barn is built down on terra-farm, the Gator will get relocated as well...

I have one other super cool truck project looking at the moment, but I will withhold the particulars until I figure out if it all will fit... I guarantee you'll will love it!

KensAuto · « **Reply #175 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:52:33 PM »

Today, I balanced and rotated the tires.
This time, however, we removed the pressure sensors and installed a bag of that poly balancing powder in each tire. Doing so necissitated removal of the pressure sensors.

Normally, removal of those sensors would each trigger a low pressure light and illuminate the tire pressure low caution symbol.

However, I built a little $10 device to trick the system and make me happy.

Here's the pieces parts:

All I did was to create a portable little pressure vessel constructed of schedule 40 PVC rated at over 300psi, using a tire valve stem, and sealing the sensors inside. Once glued shut and allowed to set up, I pressurized the tank, and strapped it under my seat!

Done

Perfect balance on the tires and no flashing messages!

And the finish:

KensAuto · « **Reply #176 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:55:02 PM »

Here's something else of a mild concern

Take a look at this photo and what are you looking at???

Are you noticing the dark then light, then dark variations of that loss of traction event?

What causes that is the torque of the drivetrain and powerplant winding up the rear spring into an "S" shape, then the spring violently recoiling. ANd over and over. When the spring wraps up, it pulls the tire upward resulting in a loss of traction and tire patch contact.

We call this wheel hop, and this is what it looks like.

So

Looks like traction bars are in my future.

A custom set of course!

KensAuto · « **Reply #177 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:55:12 PM »

KensAuto · « **Reply #178 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:56:40 PM »

Just got off the phone with Ryan over at Industrial Injection.

He posted in another spot about their soon to be compound turbo kit.

He says it is one of their best engineered kits to date and is looking at a release in a few weeks to market.

I believe I will sign up to bolt one on and see how well it works. I suspect it will do a great job of forcing more air into the stock turbo which should lower EGT's substantially and create the foundation for a lot more horsepower.

Obviously with the arrival of injectors, a gooder high pressure pump (Mo-fuel), and tuning to make it all go bang at the proper time, this kit could produce a mountain of useable power. So that's the big caveat, it will be a great addition in a foundational way for future growth.

More to come as I get information and pictures.

KensAuto · « **Reply #179 on:** November 24, 2014, 10:59:34 PM »

The focus will be switching to suspension for the next little bit

With that axle wrap and me looking at those blocks, well, me isn't that happy with all that, so here goes again!

The short plan is to add in the air bags, although on more or less, custom mounts.

I have also started the process with Alcan Springs to build out a set of techy custom springs to get rid of all the blocks which will help control body roll a bunch. Those will all get done over the next month. After adding them in, I will decide if I need a rear sway bar or not.

Meanwhile, I have a radical front sway bar setup coming together that is something never seen before on a HD truck. It's definately different and that gem will be going onto the front end.

After that the front droop bump stops are going to go bye-bye and a set of air-bumps installed to control the added droop out and probably a set of longer travel shocks.

We'll see how the rear shcoks go. Since I relocated the lower shock mounts, I got a lot more droop-out back there, but with the new Alcans, there will more of that going on.

Initially, I'll have to build a ramp to test the results of the mods to document the changes.

Oh, and I may have a cure for the common turning radius problem which I seem to have (All lifted trucks have, actually)

And of course, the tactical topper will shortly be reclaiming it's spot in the shop...

......Well, I've been busy sourcing the next batch of parts. We will be diving into the front and rear suspension as well as doing some exotic things to the engine.
This morning I'm off to get the truck weighed, front/rear/total so that some really smart guys can design me up a set of springs to make my truck mo-better!

Something else has caught my attention and will deserve some attention. Along the multi-fuel theme of this pseudo-survival vehicle I think I need to start looking into exactly that. I have done some homework already on bio fuels (Chicken grease) and the like. There are some technical difficulties with regard to fuel mapping since the fule immersed injectors operate in the manner they do, given the viscosity of the juice they're squirting. Change all that and the ratios could go bye-bye. Soy based bio fuel is mo-slippier than the EPA crap forced upon us, ULSD.
But fear not, that code can be broken and we can figure out how to harden the fuel system to run that fuel. We already know Jet-A is dryer and harder on diesel pumps, OK. Waste Vehicle Oil is all over the spectrum and Waste vegetable oil, requires a bit of a process, however for around $1500 one can make around 50 gallons a day.

What we haven't looked at and I believe is the next big thing is LNG!
The US of this A is covered with it. Liquified natural gas is so cheap to produce that folks will stop making the stuff for lack of a decent profit margin unless demand is increased exponentially.
Read the book of Don, chapter, "Stuff that makes sense" and you'll see that all the money guys (driven by the desire to make more) need to do is to create a market.
So what, build ten million new homes? Naw, don't think so. Convert our nations heavy trucks to LNG, hmmm, for a dumb pilut I just might be on to something.
Gentlemen mark my words, LNG is coming to a neighborhood near you and it should be in the sub $2 a gallon range and will decrease over a few years before stabilizing for a long time around $2 a gallon. So, I think I need to cipher all that out and get some piliminary plans cooked up!

OK, off to the weigh station, wish me luck...plenty of jap and kolean kars along the way, and rusty fords!

KensAuto · « **Reply #180 on:** November 24, 2014, 11:00:09 PM »

Just got back from Looking at Big Red

and Weighing the truck

Both were surprising to me.

Big red was making all the other Case heavy equipment look, well, uglier, yea it's that bad looking!

And that truck of mine is heavy

Here's the official results

Front Axle: 5040 lbs

Rear axle 3560 lbs

Total weight 8600 lbs

I was in it and it had a full tank of fuel and one fuel can full as well

KensAuto · « **Reply #181 on:** November 24, 2014, 11:01:01 PM »

(4665)
Zooming out to the big picture here, Tentatively, I was contemplating adding both air bags directly on top of the differential housing.

Allow me to 'splain Y...

The suspension is about to undergo a metamorphesis (Yes I know I kan't spel) Jus cus I writ ah buk dosnt meen I's kan spel korrectly!

All right moving on...

I plan to build a lot more flex into the suspension starting pretty soon. With respect to those air bags, they get bolted to the axle and the frame, as in they aren't moving at those points. I think there comes a point where one side of the axle droops out enough to literally tear those bags apart.

If, however I mount then at the roll center, then they will move very little with respect to drooping out one side of the suspension.

I will have to construct another cross member and fab up a base, but that's about it.

THe first thing being built is the rear springs. After talking with Fernando at Atlas Springs last night, I decided they would be building the rear springs. These springs will be designed to carry around 3600 pounds and probably have a dual rate. He was talking about some of the spring being 120 lbs/in and some of it 140 lbs/in. He is into the durometer of the rubber of the bushings and all sorts of technical stuff. The springs will be built with 4" more arch to eliminate the Fabtech lift block and therefore reduce the rolling I get going around corners somewhat.

So it looks like maybe air bag, then springs, and possibly something else...

A shackle flip. Cool part about that is by lengthening the actual shackle strap and angling it forward, all of that can be made into a bunch more droop out.

I think I will be shooting for a 70/30 or 65/35 ratio of suspension travel between the rear and the front. That works pretty well for IFS with some mo-off road capability.

Remember, the thing I really want is to leave the road at a high rate of speed to enter a field and not sustain damage. Whilst (Queens english) the Hyundai with the biker gang in tow folds up and serves as moving target practice when I stop for a moment...

KensAuto · « **Reply #182 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:15:01 PM »

Posted by stlaser:
Couple of thoughts and I'm throwing these out at random so bear with me here...

First, why are you sticking to leaves? They limit you in so many ways that I don't even know where to start the list at? Your not hauling big red around and in essence this whole idea of using a truck as a truck flew out the window a long time ago.

Why not attack this from a better angle, ditch the leaves. Then double triangulate a four link, finish it out with coil overs and something special.

I haven't viewed your design for the bags in the middle of the axle but I'm lost in that regards as well as to why?

And I'm not going to let the cat out of the bag about the stuff that was discussed yesterday but here again the leaves limit you so why go to all the trouble for a lack luster result.

Obviously I hate leaves, they suck in a off road environment and every bracket gets hung up on something when your traversing the terrain. In essence you want one of our KOH rigs that can go mountain crawling or 150mph across the desert floor. Leaves ain't gonna get the job done. Not to mention your spending a mountain of cash to keep adding band aids just for the sake of keeping those dumb leaves.

The front IFS is fine, you know this. In fact the high dollar KOH cars like the one Campbell runs has IFS and a trick LS7 or 8 or whatever the last revision GM put out and his IFS fronts hold up. So set the rear up like it should be and haul those stock leaves to the junk yard where they belong already!
Sorry, that was a mouth full but this has been bugging me for a couple of days now......

You know, if you look in the middle, not to full flex trail busting but in the middle between that and stock, there is an area. That area fits well into the cost effective arena where one is spending $700-$1000 in lieu of the money to link stuff up. Last time I linked a truck the coilovers cost me $1200, jonny joints, tubing brackets and the like, a ton more.

So, that's my short answer why a flexy leaf spring pack is a pretty good solution considering it will be much more advanced that stock, and that stock does a pretty good job in-in of its own.

We may not agree, but that's why I'm going with Mr. Leaf (ies)

stlaser:
Sorry, I look at the rest of the truck (over the top) and then I see you sticking with leaves (which did I mention I dislike?).......

Ya know, I think you did mention that...

KensAuto · « **Reply #183 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:17:19 PM »

Quote:
Originally Posted by KensAuto
That's a shame....to miss out on all the great conversations, like one guy trying to convince another guy, that was born in the front seat of a leafsprung model A, that someone actually makes something a little more advanced.....like coils of spring steel (w/less mass and 'bind') instead of a bunch of flat pieces bolted together in some primitive matter. haha. Actually goin' to take Don's side on this one, just cause I ...........................well, not sure why. Maybe I'm in a good mood today.

stlaser:
I'm confused, was there something positive backing up the old guy's stance? I must have missed that part.....

KensAuto · « **Reply #184 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:22:58 PM »

Posted by Armalite:
I have to play opposite Don here... I like the idea of the coils. Allow more flex, and a good ride. If you wanted to go way out there with the duramax, then come up with a rear coil suspension, and let the leafs by by-gones ! I completely get the leafs for what the truck was designed to do, but, you have cleared that hurdle about 23 pages back...

Both function and serve a purpose. Just me personally, I would like to see a coil rear setup for an off road duramax.

KensAuto · « **Reply #185 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:23:47 PM »

Posted by stlaser:
My opinion is if he tries to go from good road to dirt those leaves are going to hate life and your back is going to hate it as well.

With that said I understand Don not wanting that 4 link crap and the fact he encountered problems on his tundy up front with it. However that was a steer axle and things can get slightly more complicated in that regards.

I like the thought of bags and coils, plus the fact that if he builds the lower links correctly it will have a positive impact on the amount of jap cars he can run over as he will slide on those bottom links and the other added benny is protecting that rear driveshaft as a result. IMO too many positive to stick with crappy leaves. Did I mention I dislike leaves?????

KensAuto · « **Reply #186 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:26:12 PM »

Flyin6's response:
I have a story I haven't shared yet, a horrible tale. Has caused me many a sleepless nights.
Once upon a time in a land far, far away I was driving a truck, may it rest in peace, that had those coiled snake springs out back just waiting to unleash their pent up energy upon some poor unsuspecting someone.
Well, sadly, the day came.
It was over at the mall, on the Ohio side. State regulations (I later discovered) allow those massive walls of granite to be 1/4" taller than the mountainous ones we have here at the kintucky. Well, my vehicle, the mighty hummer was humming right along when I saw it. It was upon me before I could do anything! Even with my finely tuned and trained sense for impending danger and my lightening fast reaction I was unable to do nothing and the might H2 plowed directly into the front precipice of that towering wall! The violent compression of the front suspension caused the statue of the hula dancer on the dash to wiggle, and outside of normal limits. I'm not going there but it was practically obscene!
Then it happened...The rear of the vehicle, which was still connected to the front at that time struck the monolith! The forces the impact generated rivaled those present at the creation of the universe! During the violent crash sequence, somehow the coil spring became slightly dislodged on it's mount...I believed it actually turned a quarter of a turn, rendering the vehicle undriveable. I actually had to have it towed away and since it was all horribly twisted as evidenced by several areas of streaking in the dust, I could not even trade the vehicle and had to have it crushed. I found out later they made one hundred fifty elantras out of the scrap.
So it may be all funny to you two clowns, but to me, talk of these awful coils dredges up old hurtful memories which I thought I had put to rest.
I hope you two feel good about yourselves!

KensAuto · « **Reply #187 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:26:26 PM »

KensAuto · « **Reply #188 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:30:30 PM »

Getting parts and steel together for the air spring install. Looks like I will be making a custom crossmember if I do the center mount concept
I was thinking about how that might affect rolling in the corners. I have to do more research, but just putting the bags outboard should work against body roll whereas placing them in the center might aggravate the roll issue.

I definately need to think this one out

Any suspension engineers out there with something to add to this conversation?

KensAuto · « **Reply #189 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:34:06 PM »

Quote:
Originally Posted by *****
I have never seen bags in the center. Ever. Corners. Viair for the control valves. The best possible is Viair.

I have, although I cannot verify if the system worked properly, I am beginning to suspect it is not an optimal setup
I found some roll center force calculations and sure enough if you move the roll center higher and the pivot point inboard, the roll forces can be compounded.
I'll have to rethink the design I was contemplating...

I'll explain what I was going to do.
I am having Atlas Spring build me a new set of leaves that will carry the weight I anticipate once the tac topper is installed. I planned for the springs to carry the empty weight which will be 3800ish, then add in the bags to carry the weight beyond that, say when I add fuel and water to the cans and fill the back end up with stuff.
Knowing I was going to add a rear small diameter sway bar to control the roll when off road and going slow, I thought I'd get the air springs high up in the center where they are away from everything,
Then I started thinking...
Then the post and conversation
Then I found the engineering formulas
Then I plugged in some numbers and found
THat Zeakes comments were correct
So, we'll switch back to air springs to the outside, and just work out the mount issue.

And I get the whole leaf spring twisty thing. I played at that game a lot with the tundra which still sports a set of custom Alcans out back. I discovered all sorts of ways to get more twist out of them and that is what we are currently doing with the Atlas spring build (I think)
As far as the contraption bar, I have discussed it with the Atlas builder so we'll see if he can design the hop out of the spring. If not, I'll add just one exactly like the one I designed and welded up to my tundra...I'll see if I can find some pics of that build

KensAuto · « **Reply #190 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:35:51 PM »

Here's that contraption bar
What you can't see is the front
It is attached to a shackle which freely allows up and down movement, but when the axle tries to twist, that bar is pushing or pulling straight up and down

...and yes, I cut up one of the 3-point tractor linkages I had laying around to build part of it!
Note to self: Do not ever use tractor heims for automotive builds!

KensAuto · « **Reply #191 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:39:33 PM »

Oh, I installed a 5watt solar panel on both Big Red and my attack Gator today. Then I went a little crazy and painted, well camoflaged the Gator. You can see it over on it's thread.
Here's the 5 watt panel which is going to be installed in the D-Max as well and a sneak of the gator paint:

KensAuto · « **Reply #192 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:42:33 PM »

While I'm sorting out bigger projects, I added a solar panel to the D-Max today. I found a 5watt unit for around $40 complete with a battery charging circut.

I modified the unit by adding the charge regulator directly to the panel, then taking an old unused power outlet plug and wiring that onto the circut board.
I fashioned some feet for the panel which I will add some velcro to.

The plan is to mount a couple of strips of the "hook" side of the velcro to the panel housing the passenger air bag and just set it in place. That will allow me to use that real estate while maintaining full function of the air bag.

Here's how that all went:

The "feet"
.032 aircraft aluminum

"Feet" installed and some John Deere black paint and gun lube covering the position revealing shiney aluminum, making it all nice and tactical!

Here's where I plan to stick it:

KensAuto · « **Reply #193 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:48:40 PM »

Here's some painting going on, tidying up the rear bumper some:

Next, I cut down the axle and the face of the mount as well to allow me to slide the tire in closer to the tailgate. I gained about 1.5" and looking at it, I have maybe 1/4" more space to get if I cut some more.

And now that the Tundra has gone on to greener pastures, I am reworking that side of the shop to make that space more efficient. I am using that concept, where everything has a space and spot and it will remain there until used. I even busted out some drywall under the stairs to get room to slide in two or three floor jacks.

KensAuto · « **Reply #194 on:** December 02, 2014, 10:49:55 PM »

KensAuto · « **Reply #195 on:** December 04, 2014, 08:18:14 PM »

Let's get some more stuff done on Mr. D-Max.
I saw a neat Mag light with a LED in lieu of a bulb and some neat flashlight holders. so's I's does the math and thar she blows, freshlee mounted all pretty like, and where my old joints can still flex to grab it!

Here's how that worked out:

A couple more shots

KensAuto · « **Reply #196 on:** December 04, 2014, 08:21:24 PM »

I've been busy on doing a makeover on the shop area as well...With the tac-topper project coming right up, I need max space to fabricate and a lot of organization.
I started all this by buying those new tool boxes. Well, then when I started transfereing those old tools into that new box, well, the box actually rejected some of them!
Really, it's true!
I'd put the old nasty scuffed things in there then the next morning they'd be scattered all ofer the floor...just sayin...
I can't explain it either, and frankly, the wife isn't buying it, but that's my story and I'm stickin with it!
So I spent a small fortune restocking it with new shiney stuff, and know what??? Yup, not a tool sent flyin' yet!...Fixed that problem.

Next up, I restocked the hardware, spending the rest of the small fortune I used to have, making the cost of the make-over so far, a medium fortune!

I cleaned and retasked the old tool box into a hardware bin and made that all pretty as well. For you DOT's out there liiokin for the finest thread from which to spin some fantastic lie, i must have done all that in between naps!

On the opposite side of the bay, where the Tundra had grown roots, I have been busy as well. First I knocked out the drywall under the steps creating room for two floor jacks and some jack stands. I had to rebuild the spindly guard rails as the little arangers have been doing what Rangers do, break things!
Next I removed the 36" table in the corner and remade it into a 24" table with a shelf. THat now holds the steel and tidys that corner up nicely.

This Thursday, the Chebby bumper and that big box gets handed off to a trucker bound for Calif, and it's new owner and by then I'll have the rest of the area policed up and ready for another mess!

KensAuto · « **Reply #197 on:** December 04, 2014, 08:22:44 PM »

(4898)
Picked up some cool survival thing-a-ma-bobs
I found the smaller knife for $4 and the larger one for less than $20. Not the best quality, but good enough to hack away on things then throw at Kolean Kars.
I became fascinated at the LED light thing and picked up an assortment of replacement bulb things which will find themselves in my older mag lights in the not too distant future.

Also picked up the Army FM's (Field Manuals) and survival handbooks. THere's some pretty cool things in there, and lots of pics so we pilots will be able to understand!

KensAuto · « **Reply #198 on:** December 04, 2014, 08:25:19 PM »

Project Big Red is getting a set of sweeps at the moment. They are 3" X 4" X .250" rectangle steel roll bar extenders. They will extend forward from the roof out to the front of the hood. That hood is made out of 1/2" steel! So it's super Duper strong. THe concept is to keep a falling white oak or jap car from wiping out the air cleaner and exhaust stack and possibly entering the cab area where it would quickly dispatch ole Big Don. Yup, falling trees have lots of stored energy, and they are usually pissed that you just knocked them down. SO just to keep everything on the up and up, I'm spending more of the national budget keeping that ugly red/orange/grease paint from getting scratched up!

Oh and It is that time of year once again. The landscape people dumped a load of mulch on the driveway. I shuttled most of it away with Mr. J. Deere, but enough remains to make the parking area a very dangerous place. Earlier today I got a wheel off the safety of the concrete and into the mulch. In a flash I was buried up to the frame in a 8" pile of the stuff. The grizzly was 'ah grindin', the tires were ah' squealing, and the Allison was eating over a grand worth of torques and yet with all that...nothing! I was buried for probably years. But then I remembered I had a sled dog! So I ran my winch line out to her and tied her up and gave her a hearty "Mush"
And just like that I was free!
Later I'm going to install a mount on the side of the bed for that dog, just in case I get near any more mulch!

KensAuto · « **Reply #199 on:** December 04, 2014, 08:29:35 PM »

Lets get busy melting steel and cutting stuff up again!

THis time we will be installing the rear air bags, well sorta

Didn't quite get done

Anyway, Here's the box and the stuff. I am going to use somewhere around 1/2 to 2/3rds of all that stuff.

Some of the parts are great and others are awful! The lower spring mount uses long bolts which extend about sixty feet below the axle, and seem to be designed to catch anything you might have missed by carefully maneuvering off road. So those along with the entire lower mount will become the parts of scrap heaps and one day a Kia I am sure!

Here's what it all looks like before I went crazy, or before I started chopping stuff up, I'm already crazy, well actually, I can't remember if I'm crazy or not, I'll get back with everyone on that one later!

The upper jounce bumpers are all in the way, so they go bye-bye.
That intrusive lower block with it's mega bumper pad is also in the way. That too will take a hike after getting blasted by some high velocity gases.

Then I started sawing stuff out of the way: