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Online Flyin6

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SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« on: September 02, 2015, 05:48:32 PM »
I think with the finishing (almost) of the rear bumper thing-ah-ma-jig, I'll close out that chapter of this ongoing, ever changing build and start up again here.

The focus of this thread will be initially to get the engine running and sorted out. Following that, any transmission work that is required and the development of a "Punch-out" list to getting the truck to an early operational point

I say early, because right after the thing becomes drivable, I'll need to add some leaves to the front springs, then probably install the much longer rear Chevy Silverado springs out back, then get into the side rock rail/armor/step things, and then go on to a number of other projects which this truck will see.

The early "Punch-out" list is looking like this:
1. Fix leak in fuel filler neck
2. Fix main fuel tank vent system
3. Find and fix binding accelerator pedal cable
4. Reroute fuel line to make it easier to prime the Kennedy pumps
5. Purge the fuel system
6. Connect the brake pedal to the master cylinder
7. Top up all fluids
8. Get an initial run in on the engine, then adjust and top up fluids
9. Fab up a belly plate for fuel lines and critical things
10. Build aft bulkhead for snorkel system
11. Build air plenum for snorkel system
12. Figure out how to wire in the over drive to a switch of some sort
13. Plump in the air conditioner condenser, dryer, and lines
14. As wiring is finalized, install sheath over loose wires running all over the place
15. Mount and plumb in the new aux fuel tank
16. Add in front leaves to beef up front springs
17. install new rear springs and flip the shackle
18. Re route exhaust system to clear new configuration
19 Fab new drivers door panel as a weapon/bag mount
20.Build rear hatch/door combo
« Last Edit: May 21, 2016, 10:06:59 PM by Flyin6 »
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Online cudakidd53

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2015, 06:47:18 PM »
I think with the finishing (almost) of the rear bumper thing ah-ma-jig, I'll close out that chapter of this ongoing, ever changing build and start up again here.

The focus of this thread will be initially to get the engine running and sorted out. Following that, any transmission work that is required and the development of a "Punch-out" list to getting the truck to an early operational point

I say early, because right after the thing becomes drivable, I'll need to add some leaves to the front springs, then probably install the much longer rear Chevy Silverado springs out back, then get into the side rock rail/armor/step things, and then go on to a number of other projects which this truck will see.

The early "Punch-out" list is looking like this:
1. Fix leak in fuel filler neck
2. Fix main fuel tank vent system
3. Find and fix binding accelerator pedal cable
4. Reroute fuel line to make it easier to prime the Kennedy pumps
5. Purge the fuel system
6. Connect the brake pedal to the master cylinder
7. Top up all fluids
8. Get an initial run in on the engine, then adjust and top up fluids
9. Fab up a belly plate for fuel lines and critical things
10. Build aft bulkhead for snorkel system
11. Build air plenum for snorkel system
12. Figure out how to wire in the over drive to a switch of some sort
13. Plump in the air conditioner condenser, dryer, and lines
14. As wiring is finalized, install sheath over loose wires running all over the place
15. Mount and plumb in the new aux fuel tank
16. Add in front leaves to beef up front springs
17. install new rear springs and flip the shackle
18. Re route exhaust system to clear new configuration
19 Fab new drivers door panel as a weapon/bag mount
20.Build rear hatch/door combo

Remember my dad doing similar with an old style floor light dimmer switch- yes kids, used to have to stomp left corner of driver's side floor to make the lights go bright/dim
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2015, 06:52:44 PM »
you can skip #6....
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Sammconn

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2015, 07:00:44 PM »
And #16 may have to be a do over depending on the additional weight of the rock armour and rails.
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2015, 09:06:23 PM »
this is where I would put the popcorn guy (kyle, whats up with getting a popcorn guy emoji?)!
Nate

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Offline Sammconn

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2015, 09:41:09 PM »
Yeah, no popcorn guy, and he's hard to find on the phone and make work...
And Nate, I KNOW that you miss him! ::)
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

Offline JR

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2015, 02:17:56 AM »
OMG, oh wait it isn't running yet,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Brakes, might help  ;D

Snorkel, what did I miss or does it need another???

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Offline OldKooT

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2015, 07:43:24 AM »
Oh cool a new chapter.  :D

Looking at your list it should be running by the weekend.
As was mentioned a dimmer switch makes a fine OD switch of sorts. I use one on my daily driver CTD to switch OD on and off. Which works well unless it's dark, and then I am forever blinding on coming drivers while shifting out of OD at speed LoL

Another clean alternative is to use a button on the end of the shifter stalk. I believe they use a sec gen Dodge shifter handle for such a conversion.

Good luck on your new short list, your in the home stretch and should be about ready to plan your next truck project.



Norm

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Offline BobbyB

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2015, 09:37:13 AM »
What about an actual everyday switch? You can get them pre-label "OD". I'm sure you can find a place for it relatively easy.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

Offline Sammconn

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #9 on: September 03, 2015, 09:41:26 AM »


« Last Edit: September 03, 2015, 09:43:28 AM by Sammconn »
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #10 on: September 03, 2015, 10:27:28 AM »
Look what you heathens have done to this brand new thread....shame on you. SHAME on you.

:pokeeveryoneintheface

Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #11 on: September 03, 2015, 11:40:48 AM »
Oh cool a new chapter.  :D

Looking at your list it should be running by the weekend.
As was mentioned a dimmer switch makes a fine OD switch of sorts. I use one on my daily driver CTD to switch OD on and off. Which works well unless it's dark, and then I am forever blinding on coming drivers while shifting out of OD at speed LoL

Another clean alternative is to use a button on the end of the shifter stalk. I believe they use a sec gen Dodge shifter handle for such a conversion.

Good luck on your new short list, your in the home stretch and should be about ready to plan your next truck project.




Hey Norm,
Considering the fact that I cut out the whole computer and harness, thinking it was the anti lock computer...

Yea...

Well, considering that, how would I wire that? I plan to add a switch to the shifter stalk, maybe get the 2nd gen dodge factory one...

Suggestions?
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Offline OldKooT

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2015, 12:23:15 PM »
There should be two wires leaving your transmission. If my memory serves me correctly one has juice one is a ground. The computer switched the ground to shift in and out of OD. On my old farm truck I just wired the ground (I wanna say it's blue) to a dimmer switch and away we went.

I can crawl under there and look sometime today and verify.
Norm

Are you a prepper?  "No, whats a prepper? I am just a mildly OCD farmer"

Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2015, 12:58:37 PM »
There should be two wires leaving your transmission. If my memory serves me correctly one has juice one is a ground. The computer switched the ground to shift in and out of OD. On my old farm truck I just wired the ground (I wanna say it's blue) to a dimmer switch and away we went.

I can crawl under there and look sometime today and verify.
OK, I'll craw for ya and take a pic or two. Might as well get this figured out
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2015, 02:02:51 PM »
Don, according to the wiring diagram i just pullled up for a '91, it supposedly has an overdrive module in that year. The switch (momentary?) pulses the module, it then sends signal out through 2 thermo switches and then to computer requesting solenoid activation. Ignition power at the solenoid with computer controlling the ground.
so, Norm had it right.
You can give the Solenoid power, or ground....it doesn't matter. i would ground one leg to the trans case, and run a switched power for the other side.

Offline OldKooT

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #15 on: September 03, 2015, 02:19:57 PM »
Yeah what Ken said I said LOL  I went and looked to be sure just ground something and switch power or ground it will work either way. It's a Dodge it doesn't need no computer n wires n stuff.

BTW yr speedo won't work either, or your AC or yr cruise if so equipped. It also won't charge less it's a early enough 91.5 to have a external regulator... if so it will charge. LoL

Having fun yet?  I have so far found a way to make everything on mine work with no PCM except the cruise. SO yours will be the same steps...no problem

Norm

Are you a prepper?  "No, whats a prepper? I am just a mildly OCD farmer"

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #16 on: September 03, 2015, 02:53:57 PM »
I already warned him about the alternator/a/c stuff when he chopped out the computer!! haha
But then i looked it up and found out that 91 was more primitive than I remembered....he actually has the regulator on the firewall.

Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #17 on: September 03, 2015, 05:58:44 PM »
Don, according to the wiring diagram i just pullled up for a '91, it supposedly has an overdrive module in that year. The switch (momentary?) pulses the module, it then sends signal out through 2 thermo switches and then to computer requesting solenoid activation. Ignition power at the solenoid with computer controlling the ground.
so, Norm had it right.
You can give the Solenoid power, or ground....it doesn't matter. i would ground one leg to the trans case, and run a switched power for the other side.
Ken does that mean I can switch overdrive on in any gear...like making a 7 speed trans out of this thing?
Like 1st, then 1st w/OD, then 2nd w/o OD, then 2nd w/OD...and so forth?
I suspect the OD can only be hydraulically connected from the drive circuit. But it does raise an interesting question.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2015, 06:02:19 PM by Flyin6 »
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Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2015, 06:01:57 PM »
Yeah what Ken said I said LOL  I went and looked to be sure just ground something and switch power or ground it will work either way. It's a Dodge it doesn't need no computer n wires n stuff.

BTW yr speedo won't work either, or your AC or yr cruise if so equipped. It also won't charge less it's a early enough 91.5 to have a external regulator... if so it will charge. LoL

Having fun yet?  I have so far found a way to make everything on mine work with no PCM except the cruise. SO yours will be the same steps...no problem


YEE-OUCH

I might be OK.

It is an 91.5, has the external regulator.

Ya know, when I was ah' choppin on that harness, I was thinking, "Man, this anti-lock has an awful lot of wires!"

As for the AC...I'll wire it from a AA battery and a toggle switch if I have to!

Speedo...I'll use a GPS. If the satellites are out of commission, well civilization will be as well!
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Offline OldKooT

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2015, 07:04:56 PM »
The speedo is a really easy fix, it just requires ya string a wire up to yr dash from the speed sensor, snip a wire in your cluster harness(we know ya have wire cutters) and solder and it will work like new. The AC can be wired to run easily enough but it takes some creative trickery to get it to cycle correctly...really just a older switch, I forget exactly the year required, but it works fine on mine. I probably made notes somewhere....

So really you can probably repair all inoperative systems caused by your ABS delete in a hour or so. The abs computer thingy is behind the glove box BTW.
Norm

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #20 on: September 03, 2015, 07:18:32 PM »
His a/c is non-pcm controlled as well....as long as he didn't cut out that wiring, it should still work. lol

Offline JR

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #21 on: September 03, 2015, 09:06:06 PM »
There is a kit but DIY for OD without any real electronics has been done. I would have to research it but it comes off the valve body when in 3rd gear and uses a pressure switch with a relay. In 3rd gear the pressure raises with speed is how it is supposed to work. You could also have a switch in the OD system so you could arm or disable it as needed.

I have the same tranny and is another reason I am anxious to see how the 46R does, vs going to a 47r for alot more $$$$!!
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Offline ceelibs

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2015, 06:51:58 AM »
There is a kit but DIY for OD without any real electronics has been done. I would have to research it but it comes off the valve body when in 3rd gear and uses a pressure switch with a relay. In 3rd gear the pressure raises with speed is how it is supposed to work. You could also have a switch in the OD system so you could arm or disable it as needed.

I have the same tranny and is another reason I am anxious to see how the 46R does, vs going to a 47r for alot more $$$$!!

is this what your thinking of?

http://www.transmissioncenter.net/SwapInformation.htm
« Last Edit: September 08, 2015, 06:53:19 AM by ceelibs »

Offline ceelibs

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2015, 06:53:53 AM »
There is a kit but DIY for OD without any real electronics has been done. I would have to research it but it comes off the valve body when in 3rd gear and uses a pressure switch with a relay. In 3rd gear the pressure raises with speed is how it is supposed to work. You could also have a switch in the OD system so you could arm or disable it as needed.

I have the same tranny and is another reason I am anxious to see how the 46R does, vs going to a 47r for alot more $$$$!!

is this what your thinking of?

http://www.transmissioncenter.net/SwapInformation.htm
« Last Edit: September 08, 2015, 06:54:25 AM by ceelibs »

Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #24 on: September 08, 2015, 08:50:54 AM »
Thanks for that CELIBS

I just read through it. A bit complicated, but makes the OD fully automatic with no electronics. This is the proper answer to my dilemma.
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Offline JR

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #25 on: September 08, 2015, 11:08:32 AM »
Yep, but you can do it yourself for much less. Basically just a pressure switch on the 3rd gear port. The pressure rises with speed, so at X rpm you get OD.
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Offline OldKooT

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #26 on: September 08, 2015, 02:43:36 PM »
You may be happy with it on pressure switches. But my guess is you won't be. 
Norm

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Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #27 on: September 12, 2015, 10:59:23 AM »
Still working on Big-Red/Sarge as it is presently changing from one to the other, however Dan, my welder and fabricator friend sent me a pic of the custom fuel tank he built for Square D

Dan made the water/alchy tank which also acts as a frame stiffener in the back since it's made from .250 aluminum with .500" thick mounting straps.

This tank was measured out to fit just under the bed rails and tie into both the floor and the steel halo on top of the bed. I think it is in the mid 60 gallon size range.

Nice welds!
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #28 on: September 12, 2015, 11:45:11 AM »
That looks sharp. I wish I had a tig...scratch that, I wish I had time to tig.

Offline Wilbur

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #29 on: September 12, 2015, 12:34:31 PM »
That tank will be great. I had 56 gallon capacity in a pickup a loooong time ago...it was really great knowing you could plan your fuel stops on your terms (and thus plan to pay what you wanted).

Offline Sammconn

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #30 on: September 12, 2015, 02:16:08 PM »
Nice looking tank! And nice welds!

You planning an auto or manual transfer? Don't remember if it was discussed before. Would be very nice to have that kind of on board supply, and like Norm said plan your stops.
Not to mention in a get out of dodge situation, will drastically improve range.
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #31 on: September 12, 2015, 05:42:18 PM »
Nice looking tank! And nice welds!

You planning an auto or manual transfer? Don't remember if it was discussed before. Would be very nice to have that kind of on board supply, and like Norm said plan your stops.
Not to mention in a get out of dodge situation, will drastically improve range.

Concur. Dan does some really nice work. His shop is out of this world with capability. Maybe he'll do this sort of thing for others as in a side business someday.

Pickup tube, vent and filler will all be mounted on the top. Since I'll be using a draw straw, will use an electric transfer pump. I'll either run that to the filter feeding the engine as in a true tank #2, or just pump the fuel into the main tank, making this an auxiliary tank. Likely that will be most likely. Right after this thing runs and gets drivable.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2015, 05:43:26 PM by Flyin6 »
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Offline Wilbur

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #32 on: September 12, 2015, 05:58:13 PM »
Right after this thing runs.....

Um.....Nope, don't do it Will....just leave well enough alone....don't say it....just don't go there.....

 ;)

Offline Sammconn

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #33 on: September 13, 2015, 09:02:14 AM »
Right after this thing runs.....

Um.....Nope, don't do it Will....just leave well enough alone....don't say it....just don't go there.....

 ;)

Umm... Yeah. Let's try that, umm.
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

Online Flyin6

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #34 on: September 14, 2015, 10:21:38 PM »
Well, I'm not sure those Interstate batteries are holding a charge. The engine cranks slowly, not normally at all. I had them on a trickle charge for a couple days ever since I pulled them off Dawg's trailer!

And still no prime on the pump, so I'm going to reroute the lines tomorrow to see if I can get some fuel up to the engine.

With two solid failures to complete the task at hand, I decided to do something I knew would work out

The rear bumper liner Raptor stuff is so slick, it's a bit dangerous to stand on. SO I picked up some rubber tread and glued them down
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #35 on: September 14, 2015, 11:06:13 PM »
well at least you are making an attempt to keep the natives happy....

Don't over look the stair tread tape for the bumper gription, you can even get it in yellow and black for safety

http://www.kofflersales.com/p/anti-slip-abrasive-tape.asp?itemid=3729&gclid=Cj0KEQjw4NmvBRCRp_yu2bzal4YBEiQAWfjpJtHeHD7Py9Z3sp8_a1Qjg7-pZJSxclRDGNLVh5CUqykaAgv88P8HAQ

http://www.amazon.com/3M-Safety-Walk-Outdoor-2-Inch-180-Inch/dp/B0006HVKM4
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Offline Dawg25385

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #36 on: September 14, 2015, 11:41:05 PM »
Well, I'm not sure those Interstate batteries are holding a charge. The engine cranks slowly, not normally at all. I had them on a trickle charge for a couple days ever since I pulled them off Dawg's trailer!

Ha! Nice one

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Offline OldKooT

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #37 on: September 15, 2015, 06:40:27 AM »
Don... slow cranking can also be a ground issue. Pretty common on these trucks. Just a thought...
Norm

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #38 on: September 15, 2015, 08:48:02 AM »
Don... slow cranking can also be a ground issue. Pretty common on these trucks. Just a thought...
I'll check that Norm. I installed several grounds if you recall, but who knows...?
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #39 on: September 15, 2015, 10:24:14 AM »
...bad ground, locked up engine from cobwebs occupying crankshaft journals, etc, etc. :)

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #40 on: September 15, 2015, 12:05:58 PM »
...bad ground, locked up engine from cobwebs occupying crankshaft journals, etc, etc. :)
Cobwebs...check!
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Offline OldKooT

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #41 on: September 15, 2015, 12:59:14 PM »
I have Anvil grounded as follows. Battery to Block, Battery to alt, block to frame. It had a odd issue of slow cranking without the block to frame ground. Not the first one I have had do that.

It could just be a bad starter also....I had 4 bad ones in a row from Napa.. finally rebuilt my original one and on with life.

Just tossing ideas....
Norm

Are you a prepper?  "No, whats a prepper? I am just a mildly OCD farmer"

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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #42 on: September 15, 2015, 02:37:37 PM »
No, I just think the engine is mad at you Don,,,,,,,,,,
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #43 on: September 15, 2015, 07:47:10 PM »
I have Anvil grounded as follows. Battery to Block, Battery to alt, block to frame. It had a odd issue of slow cranking without the block to frame ground. Not the first one I have had do that.

It could just be a bad starter also....I had 4 bad ones in a row from Napa.. finally rebuilt my original one and on with life.

Just tossing ideas....

I had the starter rebuilt with good parts by a local well known guy.
I went chasing down cables for awhile. I am grounded main battery thick cable to the block, block to frame, frame to front winch. Frame to rear battery, Frame to bed, frame to cab. I have every switch panel grounded to the frame to a welded on 5/16" bolt.

But the cable to the engine block may have paint under it...haven't pulled that one yet
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #44 on: September 15, 2015, 07:50:26 PM »
Well, I was all over the truck working off the punch-out list items. I pulled and checked the filler hose to the fuel tank and all of that was in correctly, but I have a nasty leak at the filler neck, so that will have to be re-done.

Look at the mess:
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #45 on: September 15, 2015, 07:53:16 PM »
First thing tomorrow before going any further is a massive cleanup of both the garage and the truck. Think I'll give it it's first ever bath

I pulled the dual Kennedy pump setup and rerouted the fuel line. Got to take a diesel bath while doing it...Fun (NOT)
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #46 on: September 15, 2015, 07:55:01 PM »
This time I mounted it 1.5" lower than before and on poly shock bushings to act as a cushion and insulator. There is some movement in the thing now and it is definitely pumping fuel
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #47 on: September 15, 2015, 07:56:53 PM »
That will get a skid plate fabbed up when I do the side armor. For now the fuel line is tucked safely away
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #48 on: September 15, 2015, 08:01:01 PM »
The reason I know it's moving fuel is that I have a couple of leaks up near the engine. Fuel is running down the main supply line, but oddly enough is not wet at the fitting.

So no clue about what's going on with that, have to wait till tomorrow.

I need to find a primmer on bleeding the entire fuel system, injectors and all. After I get the leak pinned down, I'll bleed the injectors

So that was it for today for Square D
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Re: SquareD Part 7 Start it up!
« Reply #49 on: September 15, 2015, 08:41:27 PM »