Hello Guest

Author Topic: Thoughts?? def something to think about-  (Read 5646 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Higher Caliber

  • Moderator
  • ***
  • Posts: 690
  • Staunch UP!
    • View Profile
Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« on: July 27, 2015, 07:06:21 AM »
I like Donald Trump for a lot of reasons- my fear is he will end up third party and pull votes thus leading to killary's anointing... but he will open eyes to a third party nonetheless...

http://www.redflagnews.com/headlines-2015/why-obama-and-hillary-must-stop-donald-trump-at-all-costs
"Lions mustn't concern themselves with the opinions of sheep"
           
                                    Molon Labe!

Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2015, 08:26:37 AM »
I agree with what he says but wish he could deliver it a little more tactfully. But that may be his schtick. He is either insanely brilliant or a tool of the left to split the party. He may wind up dead. Everyone else that was a threat to Clinton did. I lived in little rock for 5 years right after he got elected and ran with some people who knew them well. They are ruthless.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline WVRigRat08

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 3
  • Happy Happy Happy
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2015, 08:53:08 AM »
Hillary cannot win. I can't afford any more taxes. Obama got 32% of what I made last year. Hopefully getting married helps a hair.
05 Chevy LLY ccsb LT Bulit motor, trans, tuned by Blackout Performance-gone

08 GMC Sierra SLT- Basic Reger-proof and hauling mods

Offline JR

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13536
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2015, 04:55:32 PM »
Well, Hillary can win but I doubt the nation would recover with her after 8 years of what we have now.

They haven't even really started on Hillary yet. Even the big networks can't keep quiet forever. I also think she has health issues that have not come out yet, the Bill baggage and her age.

I think Trump is having fun, he will not run 3rd party. Couldn't afford the pay cut. he is also smart enough to do the right thing for the country. He brings up points other won't or can't talk about and the nation loves it!! I even showed my daughter the so called "racist comments" he made on youtube. When heard as said, they are not racist as all, just fact.

Kinda what the media does to people like Cruz and Palin. Take a bit of this and a bit of that making up a whole new meaning.
Retired LEO  Lifetime NRA+  Outcast in Calif

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants"

Thomas Jefferson

Offline KensAuto

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 7684
  • My abuser is named Nate
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2015, 06:27:31 PM »
Not real happy about the way he attacked McCain. The guy was a POW for 5 years....I think he deserves better.
Underpaid and misunderstood since 2014

Offline Nate

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5743
  • I like to torment Ken!
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2015, 07:17:32 PM »
and the McCain comment was taken out of context
If you need the promise of eternity in the kingdom of heaven to be a good person … You were never a good person in the first place!

Offline Dawg25385

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2064
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2015, 07:26:13 PM »
I don't really like McCain, but trying to delegitimize his war-hero status on the basis of being captured was a ridiculous move by Trump   


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2006 Chevrolet 2500 HD 6.6 - MotorOps EFI, 4" MBRP, S&B intake, AirBags and B&W Turnover Ball
Prov 27:17, 2 Tim 1:7
NRA Life Member

Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2015, 08:57:14 PM »
Mccains performance during the war has no bearing on his failed leadership and sucking up to the establishment that is taking place currently. McCain , McConnell Reid, Piolsi, boxer, all must go.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Nate

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5743
  • I like to torment Ken!
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2015, 09:10:49 PM »
agreed ^^^^^
If you need the promise of eternity in the kingdom of heaven to be a good person … You were never a good person in the first place!

Offline Dawg25385

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2064
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2015, 09:11:32 PM »
McCain and Graham saying Rand Paul is more dangerous to the country than Obama pissed me right off to be honest... Lost a lot of respect for McCain when he attacked Paul like that.

Sorry, DOT for a quick sec here...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2006 Chevrolet 2500 HD 6.6 - MotorOps EFI, 4" MBRP, S&B intake, AirBags and B&W Turnover Ball
Prov 27:17, 2 Tim 1:7
NRA Life Member

Offline KensAuto

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 7684
  • My abuser is named Nate
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2015, 10:01:58 PM »
I'm not a McCain cheerleader by any means. But I don't know how that could be taken out of context:
“He’s a war hero because he was captured,” Trump said sarcastically. “I like people that weren’t captured.”

Your right Tex, but for someone like Trump, that did everything in his power to get out the war, to insult a man to that degree makes me respect him a whole lot less.
I'm sure that's just his dark humor, (I've always been a Trump fan) but he needs to realize how deep those feelings go for some people.
Underpaid and misunderstood since 2014

Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2015, 10:05:29 PM »
He's not the most PC which is why I think he leads the polls. People are tired of the BS


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34008
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2015, 10:09:15 PM »
Lively little discussion going on here!

McCain IS a war hero...period.

Trump would be the kind of leader that scares the pants off the rest of the world. Self made man with a business mind.
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

Offline JR

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13536
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2015, 10:09:57 PM »
Have you guys forgot that ex military and really anyone with that type of training or thinking is a target now? Why is the military disarmed on US soil,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

I agree about McCain too. His veteran and war status is no excuse for what is going on now. Again it comes down to context.

It is as they say, we have a Cartel running the US right now. However they are still voted in and out.
Retired LEO  Lifetime NRA+  Outcast in Calif

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants"

Thomas Jefferson

Offline JR

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13536
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2015, 10:11:21 PM »

Trump would be the kind of leader that scares the pants off the rest of the world. Self made man with a business mind.

Yeah, lets scare the crap out of em  8)
Retired LEO  Lifetime NRA+  Outcast in Calif

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants"

Thomas Jefferson

Offline Dawg25385

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2064
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2015, 10:38:41 PM »
Don't forget... Gingrich was up in the polls last primary too for being the outspoken one, taking on the media, establishment, etc.

Still trying to get a good read on Trump. In past years my opinion was he was a buffoon, albeit a successful one, and was seeking the bright lights (remember million dollar bet with Obama?). But I'm tuning in now... So that's something. I like that he's feisty, clearly I'm not the only one...

If the primary was tomorrow... I'd have to vote Rand Paul. I guess I'll be the first to declare my pick.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
2006 Chevrolet 2500 HD 6.6 - MotorOps EFI, 4" MBRP, S&B intake, AirBags and B&W Turnover Ball
Prov 27:17, 2 Tim 1:7
NRA Life Member

Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34008
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2015, 11:00:00 PM »
Dr. Ben Carson is a substantial man. Being a black, he might neutralize Hillary's stranglehold of the concave gender
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

Offline husker77c

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 381
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2015, 11:02:00 PM »
I was really young but I still remember Ross Perot.  Im just not sure how to take Trump.  As said he's saying good things and really upsetting the establishment.  Have you ever seen both sides unite to take down an individual like this?  Even Fox is bashing him.

That being said he was a democrat up until 2009 and has been pretty cozy with the Clinton's, invited to events, and donated to the Clinton foundation.

As was said above. He's either a plant for Hillary or he ends up dead but I don't see him finishing this race.   It seems strategies revive themselves every 20 years or so which makes me think he's a plant.  Gather up R support then leave Rs hanging come crunch time.  Although Hillary might have more of an issue getting through to the primary with Sanders and his mindless millennial following.

Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2015, 11:03:24 PM »


McCain IS a war hero...period.


Agreed. 

Makes me wonder even more about his actions now.  I don't understand.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline JR

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13536
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2015, 11:07:59 PM »
As much as like Carson, he just doesn't have the backing or political knowhow. Very smart man, great ideas but just don't see it.

Walker has the knowhow and background and wins in a Democratic state, several times. Why? Well as a Rep he gets the 35-40% just like the Dem gets. It is the swing he wins AND lots of the Dems who like how things are working there.
He can talk the talk and walk the walk and doesn't get rattled. Now him with who knows for a VP and have Carson, Trump and a few others on the cabinet,,,,,,,,,,,
Retired LEO  Lifetime NRA+  Outcast in Calif

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants"

Thomas Jefferson

Offline Higher Caliber

  • Moderator
  • ***
  • Posts: 690
  • Staunch UP!
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #20 on: July 28, 2015, 01:50:05 AM »
lengthy but enlightening (just breathe and read)
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/mccain-and-the-pow-cover-up/

There is so much evidence discrediting McCain's "war hero" status... Trumps comment on the subject had no bearing for me. McCain is a prime example of where we have failed ourselves (as Americans) when we cast our votes. Too much credit is placed on an individuals service to our country (stop looking at me like that). As a veteran myself, honestly, I think it should be a requirement you have served in the armed forces to be eligible for election. Whether as a cook or a grunt or in Intelligence is irrelevant, an individual who served in whatever capacity *honorably*, has shown he/she voluntarily took up arms in defense of our nation and ought to be granted a shot at doing the same as a law maker. Veterans, generally speaking, are more service oriented, less selfish people... 

THAT is never gonna happen! Without further digression, I'll get to my point at hand. When an individual proves he is not a worthy lawmaker, we need to fire his ass without feeling sorry because he's a veteran, "War Hero". HERE's the deal... "I appreciate your service to our country in your armed forces capacity, however as a law maker, I personally give you no merit. Goodbye!" Sometimes as Americans our Patriotism is our worst enemy. I want fantastic law makers who abide by the will of their constituents. Even if I don't agree with them, I can still respect them. McCain, sirs, is not that and I have ZERO respect for him as a lawmaker, no matter his status. He's rode that train long enough.

Trump has made every decision from a businessman's standpoint not a politicians. All of our views change. He donated to the Clintons and the Clintons thusly made him a lot of money and in return he helped a lot of people a little bit of money, in the form of jobs and such. He is however unabashed to come clean on this. Establishment republicans are destroying our country, not the democrats. Our nation has evolved. I am sorry to say it, but as long as we cast our votes based on the politicians stance on social issues ( ie abortion, gay marriage, dope legalization yada yada yada) we as like minded *conservatives* will continue to lose. There are too many people who will turn out to vote in droves on the government's payroll in one form or another.

The two party system is caput. Our nation is too diverse. Our federal gov is too big. I have always said, what is right in California, aint right in Arizona. If we continue to vote federally based on social issues to which THEY SHOULD HAVE NO SAY on a state level, our version of the American dream is dead and the progressive "change" is realized. Keep their progressive bull crap in their metropolis' and let them fall like Rome. Give us all the opportunity to live as the majority sees fit. I don't care if it takes re-structuring the map geopolitically.

look here (more fun to read)-
http://www.wearethemighty.com/second-civil-war-2015-07

I like trump, I like carson Lets go Trump/Carson 16' Hooah? (is this a hooah free zone?)
"Lions mustn't concern themselves with the opinions of sheep"
           
                                    Molon Labe!

Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #21 on: July 28, 2015, 08:15:20 AM »
Damn. Well said.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34008
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #22 on: July 28, 2015, 10:42:59 AM »
Hooah free zone status: Granted

Good rant HC,

But obviously all plagiarized...Grunts can't think like that!  ;)

You guys just eat once in awhile, sleep even less, complain and steal things while awake, then go out and break things, make noise, and hurt people the remaining time...
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

Offline Nate

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5743
  • I like to torment Ken!
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2015, 11:27:21 AM »
and is that not what they were trained for don.............?
If you need the promise of eternity in the kingdom of heaven to be a good person … You were never a good person in the first place!

Offline BobbyB

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 3030
  • "You are not LaBeouf"
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2015, 11:44:24 AM »
Grunts can't think like that!  ;)

You guys just eat once in awhile, sleep even less, complain and steal things while awake, then go out and break things, make noise, and hurt people the remaining time...

Sig worthy
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!
your standard grunt level CQB is just putting rounds and rounds on scary stuff till it stops scaring you!

Offline Wilbur

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 1538
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2015, 12:16:36 PM »
I think Trump has clearly found a story that resonates with the American public. And I do like that he is an unrepentant AMERICAN first and foremost (which I can not say about our current POTUS). I also think he is a bit of a loose cannon and will say things that make people cringe (like the McCain comment) which could let him sink his own ship if handlers don't reign him in. One problem I see with him is that he is first and foremost a Trump flagwaver....that he and he alone have all the great ideas. I am not sure he can ever play second fiddle, right wrong or indifferent. One thing I always respected about W was how he surrounded himself with VERY smart people (Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Powell, etc.). I HOPE that Trump would do that but to this point I have not witnessed that (not saying he couldn't or wouldn't, just that I need to be shown it that's all).   

I really like Scott Walker, as he has governed a state (I think fundamentally Congressmen and Senators are poorly prepared to be President's because they never ever have to be "the one" they are always one of 100 or 1 of 435). I also like how he has taken on the unions to do what is right for his state (I see a little Reagan firing the Air Traffic Controllers in his moves).

I like Ben Carson as well. but I don't think he has the charisma to win the white house. Sadly our country is all about the 10 second sound bite and his quiet measured approach (which I think would be truly invaluable as POTUS) doesn't play well to a mainstream media that will want to tear him down. I think he would be a GREAT cabinet member.

I like Carly Fiorina (not love, like) and like that she could blunt Hillary's "vote for a woman" BS. but I don't know if she'll get through the primary as it stands right now.

Lastly I LOVE how Bernie Sanders is forcing Hillary to go further left. If I had tons of disposable money I would be sending him cash as much as I could. Ha! It seems to me that in most elections the primaries are won by the most hardcore in a party (most right or left) and then the candidate has to come back to the center to get the undecided/unenrolled/independents. The more right or left the candidate has to go to win the primary the more fodder it creates for the opponent in the general election. (It was Al Gore who ultimately sank Michael Dukakis as he found the Willie Horton issue that George HW Bush used so effectively- which could absolutely be the illegal immigration issue of today!). So the more Sanders drags Hillary to the left in the primary the more she paints herself into a corner for the general election. Not to mention the ungodly amount of baggage she already brings (Benghazi, emails, pay to play etc etc.0. Plus I just think the populace is a little tired of "royal families" (We really need a PUKING emoticon for this   :o) at this point.   

Just my $0.02. Sorry to be so loooooonnnnnggggggggwinded.  ::)

Offline cudakidd53

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 3142
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #26 on: July 28, 2015, 12:21:06 PM »
My two cents, which after you guys review it, leaves me with one:

I REALLY like Dr. Ben Carson, voted for Huckabee last primary and like much of what Trump "says" - I DON'T like some things I've watched Trump do.

In Chicago, Trump Towers project, he pre-sold a sizable number of top $ Condos- well, come build time, he re-negged on those deals and told them pay more or no condo!
2012 Silverado LTZ - Duramax
Christian since 1975 - Field Trial Brittanys - NRA Lifetime Member

"When you're dead, you don't know you're dead. Hence, dealing with this fact is not difficult. It is only hard for those still living around you.....It's the same when you're stupid."

Offline JR

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 13536
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #27 on: July 28, 2015, 12:34:40 PM »
Hooah free zone status: Granted

Good rant HC,

But obviously all plagiarized...Grunts can't think like that!  ;)

You guys just eat once in awhile, sleep even less, complain and steal things while awake, then go out and break things, make noise, and hurt people the remaining time...

Ah, is there a problem with this?

Have you noticed the steady decline seems to coincide with the end of the draft?
Retired LEO  Lifetime NRA+  Outcast in Calif

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants"

Thomas Jefferson

OldKooT

  • Guest
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #28 on: July 28, 2015, 12:39:55 PM »
I have no problems saying straight up I did not vote for McCain. My only issue with what Trump said is he should have been more openly direct. In fact.... I fail to see how anyone really can see him as any sort of "war hero" Did he fly a Jet in combat? yes.... did he get shot down?...yes. Did he spend time as a POW? yes. Would he be a "hero" if he had not been shot down? No.  I am not a huge fan of Trump's, but I fail to see how he was wrong.

John Mccain was awarded by the U.S. Navy a Silver Star, a Legion of Merit for Valor, a Distinguished Flying Cross, three Bronze Stars, two Commendation medals plus two Purple Hearts and a dozen service medals. McCain had roughly 20 hours in combat before being shot down per the Navy's own records. That's over a medal per hour of combat?

Care to guess how many pilots had far more hours in combat? How many of them were shot down? How many metals were they awarded? What about the ones who much evidence supports we left behind after that war?

Yet we had men on the ground who saw 1000's of hours in combat, they are not lauded as hero's they are left to die on waiting lists at VA hospitals. We have families to this day unsure of the fate of their loved ones in Vietnam, and McCain has been no friend to those families or their loved ones. He is a Grandson and a Son of a Admiral, he left his POW experience the same weight he was when he fell out of his aircraft. He denounced the American people/government and was publicly recorded doing so. This all while other POW's starved and held there silence and their oaths. His own book explains how he felt regarding his behavior as a POW. He was ashamed of his actions, and fearful one day his Father may learn of them....

I do thank him for his service. That's all. And since he's been in Washington, I despise his lack of service to the men who fought with him, and for him. And I'd personally spit in his eye in a heart beat.

Offline Wilbur

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 1538
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #29 on: July 28, 2015, 12:42:08 PM »
like much of what Trump "says" - I DON'T like some things I've watched Trump do.

In Chicago, Trump Towers project, he pre-sold a sizable number of top $ Condos- well, come build time, he re-negged on those deals and told them pay more or no condo!

I am with you 100%. I didn't know that about the Towers in Chicago but it doesn't surprise me.

Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34008
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #30 on: July 28, 2015, 10:10:15 PM »
Norm,

It's not that McCain was shot down, heck hundreds (Thousands??) of Army pilots were shot down. It's what came later that makes him heroic. And he was in my view

He suffered two broken bones, I think either both arms or a arm and a leg. He was beaten on capture and run through with a bayonet.

He was thrown into the "Hanoi Hilton." While there he nearly died from his injuries. But luckily the communists discovered he came from a famour US Military family so he was treated and survived. They later selected him to be released back to the US as a show of "Kindness" but McCain, himself refused, insisting the communists follow the rules and release the person who was held the longest.

Because of his refusal, he was beaten nearly to death again, and several more times, He was kept in solitary most of 6 years, He was made to kneel down on stones which eventually punched holes all the way to his bones. He never gave in, he communicated with fellow solitary confinement people and passed on SSN's and names. He remained a functioning officer until his release.

He acted WAY above and beyond the call of duty. That part of the man is a matter of record and he earned those awards, again, in my view
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

Offline Nate

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5743
  • I like to torment Ken!
    • View Profile
Re: Thoughts?? def something to think about-
« Reply #31 on: July 29, 2015, 09:01:12 AM »
some may not know, but we as service members have what is called the "code of conduct".  here is a link to exactly what the code of conduct is and what it says.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_the_United_States_Fighting_Force

If you need the promise of eternity in the kingdom of heaven to be a good person … You were never a good person in the first place!

 

SimplePortal 2.3.6 © 2008-2014, SimplePortal