2002 Suburban 2500 build thread, Part 3

[Flyin6]

The tractor was necessary to transfer the heavy thing onto a motorcycle jack which I used to drag it into place beneath the Burb

[Flyin6]

I'll only be using one U-Bolt per side to save a little weight. 

Yea, that's all I had, two old U-bolts and the front spring plates off of SquareD, It worked though, sucking the axle up pretty close.

I jacked it all up until it just started to lift the body, then supported the whole thing with jack stands placed beneath the axle.

Note how the shackle has moved aft. That is good, indicating that as the spring unloads the shackle will move forward, allowing for more suspension travel

[Flyin6]

I got after those cut off shock mounts, remaking them into something I could use.

[Flyin6]

Then I tacked the shock mounts into place in a position to increase ground clearance from "wait-ah-minute" obstacles.

It turned out well

[Flyin6]

From the passenger side:

[Flyin6]

I started putting together the panhard bar parts. I will use this bent piece of DOM that was meant to be a front panhard.

You won't believe how well that fits, wait until you see it tacked up in place. I can get the bar nearly level!

[Flyin6]

While I was digging, I literally unearthed nearly a complete solid front axle swap for our Duramax trucks. Those frame plates are used to box in a 2010 and earlier Silverado. Some of this stuff is in perfect condition

[Flyin6]

I feel like the boss has gone and posted all of this in the complete wrong thread. This thread has all of that camping and overland equipment while all these posts are related to build part 3. 


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[Flyin6]

I feel like the boss has gone and posted all of this in the complete wrong thread. This thread has all of that camping and overland equipment while all these posts are related to build part 3. 


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You are correct!

And I was in the middle of trying to figure out how to move all these posts over to my build thread...

Anybody know how to do that?

[Flyin6]

I don’t but someone does. Nate maybe...

[Flyin6]

Yea, Nate!

[Flyin6]

I will move them in morning.....

[Flyin6]

You are correct!

And I was in the middle of trying to figure out how to move all these posts over to my build thread...

Anybody know how to do that?

 
 

[Flyin6]

You are correct!

And I was in the middle of trying to figure out how to move all these posts over to my build thread...

Anybody know how to do that?

 
 

Not part of flyin' or building something rusty or dirty: I would know nothing about it!

[Flyin6]

LOL!

[Flyin6]

I sometimes look up word origins

I was researching "BoneHead" yesterday.

Way back in the ancient greek

I discovered the origin of that word is from the word, "Don!"

[Flyin6]

I sometimes look up word origins

I was researching "BoneHead" yesterday.

Way back in the ancient greek

I discovered the origin of that word is from the word, "Don!"

LOL! Well, I think we've all been there in some form or fashion. Surviving boneheaded decisions is what creates experience. At least, that's been my observation of all my Armee associates. 

[Flyin6]

Have an appointment Wednesday to have the bumpers sprayed with etching primer, then LineX...

[cj7ox]

FOR ALL WHO SEE THESE PRESENTS, GREETINGS! LET IT BE KNOWN NOW, AND FOREVERMORE, THAT THE MODERATOR FORMERLY KNOWN AS NATE, HAS HEREBY BEEN DUBBED "THE MAN". FROM THIS DAY FORWARD, HE SHALL BE REFERRED TO AS SUCH, UNTIL THE GREAT OWNER OF THIS SITE, OTHERWISE KNOWN AS "BIG D", DECIDES HIS TRANSGRESSIONS HAVE SURPASSED THE AFFECTS OF HIS RECENT RESCUE OF SAID "BIG D" FROM EMBARRASING MIS-POSTS.

[longball]

Got more axle work done, but first a couple fun things

First, remember those mirrors Dave pointed me to?

Well, let's put them on!

We put that same set on a coworkers 2016 6.0 farm truck a few months ago. Install was a little more involved because the whole door panel had to come off and there was an optional fourth screw that required drilling another hole in the door. They seem like a good product. 


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[Bigdave_185]

Don did your mirrors come with turn signal in the mirror?

Also don’t forget to remove you expensive LED bulb from the take off mirrors

Earlier you were against the idea of putting lights up High do to glare off of your hood? While I think they look cool up in that rack, what is the plan for the hood? Flat black?


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[KensAuto]

Am I the only one that thinks those mirrors look level, instead of tilted upwards?

[Bigdave_185]

I can see that also, I wonder if aftermarket fixed GM for the better.   No more stacking washers,   


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[longball]

Earlier you were against the idea of putting lights up High do to glare off of your hood? While I think they look cool up in that rack, what is the plan for the hood? Flat black?


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Will the glare be that bad from spot lights? Never had a set up there so I have no idea.


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[Bigdave_185]

Earlier you were against the idea of putting lights up High do to glare off of your hood? While I think they look cool up in that rack, what is the plan for the hood? Flat black?


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Will the glare be that bad from spot lights? Never had a set up there so I have no idea.


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He was the one with the original concern


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[Flyin6]

Don did your mirrors come with turn signal in the mirror?

Also don’t forget to remove you expensive LED bulb from the take off mirrors

Earlier you were against the idea of putting lights up High do to glare off of your hood? While I think they look cool up in that rack, what is the plan for the hood? Flat black?


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Man you people have been busy!

Mirrors level? Who knows?

Mirrors have turn signals...Who knows?

Hood glare, Who knows?

Future plan for the hood? Who knows?

Guess I took care of all the questions!

[Flyin6]

So with the panhard bar, to get everything linin' up, I had to weld the bushing sleeve to the end of the shaft then load that with the poly parts.

[Flyin6]

Snugging up the bolt a bit aligned the bar with the mount on the axle. That gave me a reference point to build off of on the frame.

[Flyin6]

That's a grade 8 wing nut right there, plenty strong for mockin' up!

So I built the frame mount a piece at a time. Starting with a WFO piece, I cut that apart and started adding pieces to box in a section of frame and to spread the lateral load out a bit

[Flyin6]

I'm happy with how that panhard bar turned out. It will provide more lateral stability and help eliminate some of the tippy feel of a top heavy truck

Following that, I applied one of the door decals just to see how that would fit/look

So, like it or burn it off?

[Flyin6]

Oh, forgot to post the forward looking shot from the back. Note how level the panhard bar ended up being.

[Flyin6]

Then it was time to start cluttering up the rear wheel well and suspension.

I mocked up how the air spring will mount, function. Due to space requirements and ease of build, I located this one a bit aft of center. To place the bag at the center would require it to stretch quite a bit and I thing, possibly enough to pull the bag apart. Bu going off center the amount of movement will be less, and likely keep the thing alive much longer

[Flyin6]

In the final installation, I squashed the bag a bit to allow more room to expand

[Flyin6]

The mount is super simple. I simply welded 3/8" frame bolts directly to the frame and panhard mount. The upper mount simply slides onto the studs and bolts solidly.

[Flyin6]

With that complete except for final welding, I went after the passenger side. This side is less crowded and should be easier. I got the U-bolts cut to length but drilled the holes in the mockup plate off center so I now have an alignment problem. No worries, I'll just order the permanent plates and finish the mount when they get here. Next i'll be mounting the aft sway bar

[Bigdave_185]

I like the sticker   Big one on the hood?


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[TexasRedNeck]

Panhard bar looks good.  Not sure I concur on the bag placement, but keep us posted


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[KensAuto]

Panhard bar looks good.  Not sure I concur on the bag placement, but keep us posted


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Ditto

[Flyin6]

I like the sticker   Big one on the hood?


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Naw, just blackness, I think, on the hood.

[Flyin6]

Panhard bar looks good.  Not sure I concur on the bag placement, but keep us posted


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Ditto

OK, then, what's your thoughts on my site selection for the bag. Granted, I have never seen one placed there like that, but it would work. I just don't have thee space to place it over the spring pad like it would normally be found, so looking at all factors, I settled on the plan you see.

Look at it closely and you can see that the working center of the "pushin'" is only maybe 6" from the center of the spring pad.

[stlaser]

Try again on rear track bar mount or take it off altogether and put the bag where it belongs.... my 2 cents

[Sammconn]

I hate to agree with Shawn but I think he’s right.
Bags need to be centered.
Trackbar/panhard only need a perpendicular path to frame.

I’d move bar and centre bags too.

[stlaser]

Reality is you put cart b4 the horse. Start with the bags, get them on and functioning then decide if you really need track bar which you know you don’t but agree it is a nice feature maybe? A sway bar back there would be more beneficial imo for the high load.

[Flyin6]

Reality is you put cart b4 the horse. Start with the bags, get them on and functioning then decide if you really need track bar which you know you don’t but agree it is a nice feature maybe? A sway bar back there would be more beneficial imo for the high load.

I'm adding a sway bar too. That was next, after the bags

So can anyone make an argument why the bag would not work where I have them placed? I can't find a reason why not...

[Sammconn]

I don’t know if my logic is sound but I don’t like the loading of the bags occurring aft of the center.
The physics of it are above me but my gut doesn’t like it.
It will load the aft half of the spring significantly more that the front half.
The axle in the center twisting with the load centered behind the axle rotation is my issue.

Someone smarter than me might be able to physics it, I just don’t like the placement.

I’d like the bags above the axle, the panhard could be moved aft and sway bar where there is space left.

[KensAuto]

I would explain it about as good as Sam.
But it would probably work to some degree.

[Bigdave_185]

My logic is simple.  Grandpa W would look at something I wanted to do that wasn’t how he would do it.  Usually let me try it and it would not work, he would laugh with a heavy I told you so
I think these guys above are saying sure try it.   So they can say I told you so


However bags are easy to add later if you need them.  The sway bar might not actually be needed.   


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[OldKooT]

In all respect.... take yr panhard bar off, maybe use it as a swinging clothing rack or something useful. Install the air bags as designed where they belong. Then add a sway bar as you intended, if you feel the need.  A sway bar is only as useful as it's end links, so make sure you use stiff poly at minimal, or better yet Delrin bushings with multiple adjustment points for tuning on the bar.

I'd likely make the sway bar links a combination of Derlin and rod ends so I had minimal movement, and adjust pre-load right off of static. FWIW

Kay's old suburban 2000 3/4ton had stock rear leafs, a small block (1.5") no sway bar at all, and it towed and drove great. It also had Bilstein 5100's on it as well. I always felt Chevy's engineers got the rear suspension about right, it was the stupid IFS in front that was usually the culprit of any issues with how the truck drove. About as useful off the hyw as a drag slick.

[Flyin6]

Thanks for the responses!

OK, folks, I'll relook the air bag placement

I have a couple of ideas now that I have spent some time thinking about it

As for the panhard bar, I feel it is a good idea. GM engineers and the armcorp folks building much heavier Suburbans for government use decided they needed it. Up-armored burbs with 2" of glass and a lot of weight up higher were more in need of keeping the axle under the truck.

Now mine is no up-armored truck to be sure. I'm guessing 7K give or take when armored ones went well north of 10K. But I will have a 200 lb tent way up high on the roof. And my burb is "leveled" at 7" higher than a stocker. My burb sits on 35" tires almost 2.5" taller than stockers. Finally, my shackles point down away from the CG, which will exacerbate the rolling motion I would think.

I'll look at the air spring, panhard stays for all the reasons I mentioned, + I can't start losing build time. My window is closing soon.

As for the sway bar, I had planned to bolt it to the frame/chassis instead of the axle the way Ford designed it to fit. I always figured I would start to get pretty busy with all the stuff I was adding, and that should be easy to fit in.

So tomorrow, I'm back at it, having lost maybe 4 hours of fab time on the bags so far on the clean slate scenario.

Just ordered new stock (For a HD 2500 truck w/ff axle) hubs, seals, bearings rotors and pads. I'll be reusing the stocker calipers. That should get me home with the brake/wheel stud, fitment issue thing.

For those reasons I think the panhard will just start to come in to its own

[OldKooT]

The reason up armored SUV's use a track bar is the huge weight above the roll center of the truck as you mentioned.. My large 6 person roof top tent weighs 147lbs. not all that heavy honestly. It's cool with me if you keep the track bar...it's not like it will hurt anything. But because your Burb is no different than ours was....I offered it isn't needed. I offered because I already have built what you are....drove it, and evaluated it quite a while before my wife managed to swamp it, and watch it roll over headed down river.