Author Topic: Paint correction (Read 11121 times)

Bigdave_185 · « **on:** December 21, 2020, 02:14:12 PM »

New found spare time has brought me back to the pastime of detailing cars for $$

Lots of way to skin a car so to speak and as of 10 years ago this processes was long a hard. No fast fix at the time of 2003 to. Fix a messed up paint job or the car wash swirls or Texas pinstripes.

Here come 2020 and the products have completely changed.

When you used to have a high speed buffer to do this and risk smoking through the clear coat or worse picking up something and running it down the car scratching the whole car.

No days you use only a random orbital with 5-6 pads and smooth motion.

I have used a few brands

RUPES LHR15 III Black Random Orbital Polisher (Mark 3 Bigfoot) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07P8C8CKM/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glc_fabc_4np4Fb24W24BB

Meguiar's MT300 Dual Action Variable Speed Polisher https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00OTK5JHG/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glc_fabc_xop4FbFZKGG0B

https://www.harborfreight.com/8mm-random-orbit-6-in-da-polishersander-64528.html

But i settled on the replacement from dewalt for the battery option and the vibration in the machine doesn’t wreck my arthritis in my wrists

https://www.dewalt.com/products/power-tools/sanders/20v-max-xr-5-in-cordless-variablespeed-random-orbit-polisher-tool-only/dcm848b

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #1 on:** December 21, 2020, 02:19:50 PM »

The next question is which point do you want to get involved in this. How invested into the tooling and product.

I currently have Adams polish products.
I currently have Meguires products in use

I have yet to make a choice on which I like other then pad choices

I like the Adams microfiber cutting pad, the Meguires pads seem to mat over more so.

This is the Adams

This is the Meguirs. The nap is shorter which lends to less places to absorb the grime

The other options are these foam pads that vary in density’s for different purposes. Your final step would be a really plush foam pad to evenly coat the product on the surface of the paint.

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #2 on:** December 21, 2020, 02:37:27 PM »

Let’s start with the ugly truth. Most people’s paint is terrible from these auto wash places. This is no exception

I intend to wet sand the whole truck instead of clay bar.

3m sells pads for orbital polishes. I have one that’s a bit used so I assume it’s more along lines of 4000 grit

I’ll show you a fresh 3000 and my used pad

You need to follow a overlap pattern right and left. Up and down.
The corners need to be watched so you don’t run through.

This is the used pad. Very little abrasion

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #3 on:** December 21, 2020, 02:40:09 PM »

Now to bring back a shine with

Using the red/pink adams pad with matching pink D300. Then D302, D301, finish with the M27. Don’t ask why the numbers don’t align in a order that makes sense

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #4 on:** December 21, 2020, 02:47:32 PM »

Now I’ll suggest you watch a few videos of this from the manufacturers my intent is to show how easy it is with out paying someone else

PinkD300

Four dime size drops. Gone are the days of tons of product wasted, it also doesn’t stain your trim and plastic. As long as you wipe it off.

That’s step two. Light even pressure and use the glare to look for left over sand marks, polish again if needed
Move to the next product on the next pad

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #5 on:** December 21, 2020, 02:59:58 PM »

Step 2. D3002 helps a lot with the haze that comes from the previous polish. I don’t suggest skipping it.

Follow same process of H patter R/L, U/D.
Don’t forget you can use these on plastic lights, your glass windows, it works really well

This corner piece is black plastic and it will take a shine. No heat as you can melt it. Let the product do the work

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #6 on:** December 21, 2020, 03:03:21 PM »

Mentioned rubber seals and plastic

Wet microfiber cloth

Makes short work of the little haze

Also remember to use the corners of a damp rag to wipe excess out of the joints of glass, plastic, trim, door jams. It looks sloppy if ya don’t

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 21, 2020, 03:05:45 PM »

Step three. Next pad, next chemical d301 on a thicker pad

Try to keep the pads clean. No droppin them in the dirt Don!!
Use a small wire or plastic brush to clean them while orbital is running.

And repeat the same process.
As before

That’s ready for sealant.

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #8 on:** December 21, 2020, 03:15:45 PM »

The M27 sealant I have zero faith in as a product. Zero knowledge other then the sales rep said it’s great. So it’s on three of my cars and we will see. So far it still looks ok but don’t confuse it with ceramic coating, at least not 100% anyway

I use a red soft pad and apply on a low speed

It’s fast application for sure

The package says wipe off after 5 min or more. It takes 24 hrs to cure completely. So there is that also.

I usually do panel at a time, so I’ll move the door and come back and wipe the M27 off after that

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #9 on:** December 21, 2020, 04:22:42 PM »

I won’t bore you guys with the rest of the suv but for real there are a few things I Do know well. Painting, detailing and I’m sure if I don’t have the correct process we can figure out another option

This is kind of a lost art to what used to be a standard Dad function to now there are shops that charge $1200 bucks for this stuff, It’s a good life skill for these young kids we have. Car washin is easy money in the summer months.

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #10 on:** December 21, 2020, 04:23:20 PM »

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Flyin6 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 21, 2020, 06:13:08 PM »

Informative...Thanks!

So I had a number of take-aways.
First was the use of multiple pads. Although I already do that, I think I have used too much material on the pad, and I don't think my pad material selection fits with modern thinking. I used mostly lambs wool like I used back in the 70's.

I have used Maguire's from as early as the late 60's when I first started buffing lacquer paint jobs.

Now the Dewalt electric buffer, that is a great idea, I'm for sure going to buy one of those.

And this concept of wet sanding an older paint job is interesting (in a scary way). I think I am going to have to get a lot more advanced with the duramax truck. It has seen, well, a lot of "use" that have resulted in its share of chips, dings and little dents from flying stones, this big buzzard and a few deer. I may have run into a couple of trees along the way, but I wasn't keeping score.

So I was planning with the idea of spot repair. Correct the dent, but end up blending paint and not redoing entire panels or the whole truck. But, alas,, maybe that is the direction I may need to go

So, Dave, do you do any small chip repair? What would that process look like?

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #12 on:** December 21, 2020, 06:45:35 PM »

I have done paint repair in years past but honestly I haven’t had a vehicle in that would justify the process

It’s not complicated by any means

Touch up paint brush, build up multiple coats, apply, dry, apply, dry and so forth. Then you use similar sanding to make is smooth, then buff. That being said I don’t own a vehicle worth the effort no have I done one in a long long time. I don’t plan on doing any of that in my garage. There are air brush kits that work well also but blending in old paint with new touch up paint is no fun.

I’m going to order new pads today. I noticed the microfiber (red pad) has been coming apart, to be fair to the product it’s been through three really nasty cars!!

This was the cleanest panel. The rest the pad was solid black!!

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #13 on:** December 21, 2020, 06:47:33 PM »

Pads

I’ve not tried this blue foam pad yet. The red micro has worked excellent

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 21, 2020, 11:19:12 PM »

Did some further inspection of this hood and why my pads were black black! The clear coat is gone, Because the climate this vehicle has been in the clear coat is prone to being “baked off”. So as I polished and waxed I was removing paint. I first assumed it was Oxidation like you get on boats, the color comes through the Gel coat over time.

In this 2007 the hood is clear coat free. For long term protection I’ll look in AMMO ceramic coating. Once application every few months would be recommend or.... have the hood re sprayed clear.

The roof of the vehicle has zero of the same issues

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TexasRedNeck · « **Reply #15 on:** December 22, 2020, 07:33:05 AM »

Good write up Dave.

I’ve got the Girot’s polisher and pads. I’ve just begun to scratch the surface of detailing. I did some work on the front cap of the RV years ago and then did the dually and Bus. The clay is a pain. The Bus really needs a paint job on the hood and roof, but I may just have the whole thing shot.

I just don’t have the time right now. Wish you were closer.

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #16 on:** December 22, 2020, 09:33:37 AM »

They have plane tickets Charles lol I currently Have minimal obligations also

My hood on my truck has spider cracks in it that when buffed make them look worse. The roof has paint blown off down to primer.

What style of pads does griots use?

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TexasRedNeck · « **Reply #17 on:** December 22, 2020, 11:10:33 AM »

Same. Micro fiber and foam systems with Velcro

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #18 on:** December 26, 2020, 03:50:32 PM »

On to the next truck. Some major scratches but alll else looks really good. Not sure who drags tree branches down the side of a pickup

Can’t do it my self.

She will look good here in a hour or so once finished the other side

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Nate · « **Reply #19 on:** December 26, 2020, 04:54:59 PM »

Did you get a new truck?

Bob Smith · « **Reply #20 on:** December 26, 2020, 07:08:29 PM »

Quote from: Bigdave_185 on December 26, 2020, 03:50:32 PM

On to the next truck. Some major scratches but alll else looks really good. Not sure who drags tree branches down the side of a pickup

Can’t do it my self.
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I am one of those that used to put scratches down the side of my truck, then bought a jeep to use hunting. I don’t normally drive overgrown roads, but sometimes you have to.

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #21 on:** December 26, 2020, 08:48:06 PM »

Quote from: Bob Smith on December 26, 2020, 07:08:29 PM

Quote from: Bigdave_185 on December 26, 2020, 03:50:32 PM
On to the next truck. Some major scratches but alll else looks really good. Not sure who drags tree branches down the side of a pickup

Can’t do it my self.
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I am one of those that used to put scratches down the side of my truck, then bought a jeep to use hunting. I don’t normally drive overgrown roads, but sometimes you have to.

I think a dedicated off roader is a good idea, thinking about what guys pay for some of these new trucks then drive them up into the mts and what not

This was behind a tail light

How do you get that much dirt under there? There was so much dirt/mud I couldn’t see the lightbulbs in the back of the light

As I vibrate the panel I kept trying to figure out where my clean garage floor was getting sand and dirt, it was completely covered on the bottom of the truck. I was so shocked.

Iv had mud cakes under my truck and spend hours under it washing it out. Others don’t seem to have that dedication

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #22 on:** December 26, 2020, 08:50:05 PM »

Quote from: Nate on December 26, 2020, 04:54:59 PM

Did you get a new truck?

No sir

This is a guy who purchased a 2015 3500hd 100k miles $32000 from a lady in Montana this summer. He asked if I could take the cowboy pin stripes out of it.

I was successful
And didn’t take a final photo as he drove out of the garage into the rain storm

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dave945 · « **Reply #23 on:** December 26, 2020, 10:27:02 PM »

Dave, you’re making me seriously consider washing my van. Not sure it will go much further than that, but even that would be an improvement. I figure at 495000 miles, the dirt might be the only thing keeping it together.

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #24 on:** December 27, 2020, 12:21:41 AM »

I think that many miles I wouldn’t change a thing your doing. You might have the secret

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Flyin6 · « **Reply #25 on:** December 27, 2020, 10:39:40 AM »

Quote from: dave945 on December 26, 2020, 10:27:02 PM

Dave, you’re making me seriously consider washing my van. Not sure it will go much further than that, but even that would be an improvement. I figure at 495000 miles, the dirt might be the only thing keeping it together.

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You just gave me an idea...

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #26 on:** January 20, 2021, 05:26:43 PM »

Don’t forget to pull those fender flares off fellas

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #27 on:** January 20, 2021, 05:28:05 PM »

Most of these GM fenders are held on with the push clips and 3m tape. The tape does a good job for lots of years. Buy new tape and suggest new clips to reinstall the fender flares

Use your eraser wheel to take the old adhesive off.

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #28 on:** January 20, 2021, 05:30:19 PM »

There also isn’t much to be done here but make sure you keep them clean.

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Farmer Jon · « **Reply #29 on:** January 21, 2021, 07:25:32 AM »

Auto detailing is one thing I have never had the patience for. I am going to give it a shot. The 5th wheel we bought a year or so ago has smooth aluminum siding with fiberglass end caps. The paint is all chalky. I at least want to do the rear cap.

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #30 on:** January 21, 2021, 05:18:22 PM »

It’s not bad to do those big flat areas, just time consuming

I’d start with a good boat wash,
This is a brand I have used with great results

https://blingsauce.com/products/hot-sauce

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #31 on:** January 21, 2021, 05:19:41 PM »

Got the fender flair back on the driver side, going to detail a dodge Cummins next week on Monday so I’ll finish my personal truck later.

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TexasRedNeck · « **Reply #32 on:** January 22, 2021, 12:26:44 AM »

Hmm. Perhaps you need to ditch the part time gig at the local store and make that trailer of yours into a mobile detail trailer....

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #33 on:** January 22, 2021, 12:43:23 AM »

Been giving that a thought actually, I could turn this into a gig pretty easy,

Allow me to work when I can, do kid things when I can.

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wyorunner · « **Reply #34 on:** January 22, 2021, 06:24:36 PM »

I can attest to the benefit and enjoyable life that comes from working for oneself!!! Been doing it for a long while now.

Flyin6 · « **Reply #35 on:** January 24, 2021, 11:42:18 AM »

Quote from: Bigdave_185 on January 21, 2021, 05:19:41 PM

Got the fender flair back on the driver side, going to detail a dodge Cummins next week on Monday so I’ll finish my personal truck later.

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That is flippin' outstanding work!

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #36 on:** April 25, 2021, 01:47:00 PM »

Let’s add some things to remember when doing detailing

1. How thick is my paint?

2. Is it the same thickness everywhere?

3. Is the surface smooth or curved?

4. Is the paint/clear coat soft or very hard?

When looking at the gas tank I know there is lots of layers of paint, but each layer has a different level if that makes sense. To make this kind of detail they painter adds layers of clears and color to add to the depth.
But taking that into consideration the last layer of clear can be thin and I can polish or sand into the next layer of detail which would ultimately wreck the whole paint detail. So I chose lite lite sanding.

Also it’s a round surface so my buffer isn’t going to have 6” of contact, it’s going to have maybe 3” of surface contact so less less less pressure via my hand and slow speed as to not more to much material to fast beyond my control.

The round area of the tank makes paint want to run away from it. Similar to a door edge of a pickup or the rounded corner on the hood. The paint by nature is thinner at that point. No I don’t understand completely why other then gravity and the abrasive ness of the surface. Paint runs right ? So on all the rounded areas it also decreases my paint thickness. Watch for that!!

The clear coat on this bike is old! It’s brittle and overly thick in areas. To the point where I can pop it off around the gas cap. It also on my test spot with the sand paper left really smooth scuff marks which makes me think it’s not soft it’s hard. Soft paint will be tacky feeling under the paper. Your hand will slide less. Think sticky tires vs hard rubber compound. The softer the more grip the harder the less grip from the paper. So I used a fresh 3000 grit paper and wet sanded the heavily scratched areas.

Finished product isn’t perfect but it will do for it’s intended purpose of holding the bike builders ashes on the wall.

Notice how the bottom of the tank looks so dark before polish. Clear coat paint is like a lens on your glasses if it’s dirty the image isn’t as clear. Then after cleaning and polishing it brings out all of those little details in the hand and the robe.

I do wish they put a little more detail into the rose when he did the paint but... not mine not my work and it’s still different

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JR · « **Reply #37 on:** April 25, 2021, 05:02:12 PM »

I pulled a fender off the Dmax a few months back. Didn't buff it out but shure cleaned it out good first. Lots of 15 year old junk in there.

Very nice work Dave.

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #38 on:** April 26, 2021, 04:42:43 PM »

Rain day!! Might as well polish a dump truck

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Flyin6 · « **Reply #39 on:** April 26, 2021, 08:46:21 PM »

That thing looks really good!

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #40 on:** December 26, 2021, 10:55:48 PM »

On to the next project for a guy who likes to drive in the woods

He didn’t want me to go all in as he will take it out next week but wanted to keep a better hold of good looking rig,

He has some really hard water spots, lots of chips and paint etching from chemicals Iv never seen before. Lots of redneck pin stripes and some overspray from the morons who sprayed his rubber bed liner.

I didn’t take any good photos of the pin stripes but the hood does show the spots where the clear coat is etched beyond my willingness to correct for the $ agreed on.

Lots of striping will come out, water spots and swirls will be good as gone!

Photos to come

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #41 on:** December 27, 2021, 12:47:37 AM »

Center line of hood to the back of rear fender, cut, buffed, polished and hybrid coatings

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #42 on:** December 27, 2021, 05:25:57 PM »

Finished!

O

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #43 on:** January 01, 2022, 10:25:43 AM »

The next polish project is a 2017 Harley in need of love.
Found the owner uses glass cleaner and paper towels from the gas station to clean his paint while on long trips!

Test spot on the top of the saddle bag but for a black bike I’m sure it will be a easy process just hard to get around the little dodads and thingamobobbs

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Flyin6 · « **Reply #44 on:** January 01, 2022, 11:35:29 AM »

Dave, not prying, mostly just curious, but what does it cost to do a full paint reconditioning on a full size truck, then on a car, say Passat size?

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #45 on:** January 01, 2022, 03:16:37 PM »

I have two price points I work off of, those who I like as friends and close friends $75 a hour those who I don’t know $100-125 pending on vehicle

I take into account the cost to repair the vehicle if I mess it up, the condition the owner will keep the vehicle in, are they repeat customers.

If it’s a guy like say the red dodge who runs it through the auto wash every day on the way home I don’t expect him to be back in six month for a touch up, the likely hood of a year probably.

The dodge took 12 hours of work
My truck takes 8
The Harley I figure about four hours after removing The things and re installing

Does that answer your question?

The Passat type suv I’d toss $800 bucks out with not seeing its condition

Your black truck back to perfect would be probably $1200. If you took it to one of the local shops it would be over $2k

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Flyin6 · « **Reply #46 on:** January 02, 2022, 11:35:12 AM »

Quote from: Bigdave_185 on January 01, 2022, 03:16:37 PM

I have two price points I work off of, those who I like as friends and close friends $75 a hour those who I don’t know $100-125 pending on vehicle

I take into account the cost to repair the vehicle if I mess it up, the condition the owner will keep the vehicle in, are they repeat customers.

If it’s a guy like say the red dodge who runs it through the auto wash every day on the way home I don’t expect him to be back in six month for a touch up, the likely hood of a year probably.

The dodge took 12 hours of work
My truck takes 8
The Harley I figure about four hours after removing The things and re installing

Does that answer your question?

The Passat type suv I’d toss $800 bucks out with not seeing its condition

Your black truck back to perfect would be probably $1200. If you took it to one of the local shops it would be over $2k

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Yea, I'd pay you $1200 to fix my truck, but it has lots of chips and a couple of dents...one in the hood where I hit a buzzard. The deer bouncing off the front, oddly enough have left no marks at all!

Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #47 on:** January 02, 2022, 01:29:02 PM »

That the hard part about rock chips, the more you polish the paint the more the chips stand out.

Really the PPF film is the best option for a truck that sees any off-road use

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TexasRedNeck · « **Reply #48 on:** January 03, 2022, 02:57:12 PM »

Quote from: Bigdave_185 on January 02, 2022, 01:29:02 PM

That the hard part about rock chips, the more you polish the paint the more the chips stand out.

Really the PPF film is the best option for a truck that sees any off-road use

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Smartest thing I’ve heard a “Dave” say. :-)

I put PPF on everything nowadays. It’s a tough nut to spend $1200 on a new vehicle but it’s worth it if you plan to keep it any length of time. I typically take mine directly from the dealer to shop. The dually I sold to a forum member here has it in the front and the rear fenders. It had no chips when I sold it and I would wager it still doesn’t.

The new denali has it on the front including the lights (warranties against light breakage and helps with hazing and yellowing) and I had them custom cut a piece for the c pillar where I always seemed to hit my trucks with my brief case bag with putting it in the back seat.

There is a new film for the exterior of the windshield that claims to prevent rock chips but I have not tried it yet.

I did get the heat rejection clear film put on the inside of the windshield since it’s illegal to tint the windshield in Texas. That made a big difference in the summer too.

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Bigdave_185 · « **Reply #49 on:** January 03, 2022, 08:33:25 PM »

Quote from: TexasRedNeck on January 03, 2022, 02:57:12 PM

Quote from: Bigdave_185 on January 02, 2022, 01:29:02 PM
That the hard part about rock chips, the more you polish the paint the more the chips stand out.

Really the PPF film is the best option for a truck that sees any off-road use

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Smartest thing I’ve heard a “Dave” say. :-)

I put PPF on everything nowadays. It’s a tough nut to spend $1200 on a new vehicle but it’s worth it if you plan to keep it any length of time. I typically take mine directly from the dealer to shop. The dually I sold to a forum member here has it in the front and the rear fenders. It had no chips when I sold it and I would wager it still doesn’t.

The new denali has it on the front including the lights (warranties against light breakage and helps with hazing and yellowing) and I had them custom cut a piece for the c pillar where I always seemed to hit my trucks with my brief case bag with putting it in the back seat.

There is a new film for the exterior of the windshield that claims to prevent rock chips but I have not tried it yet.

I did get the heat rejection clear film put on the inside of the windshield since it’s illegal to tint the windshield in Texas. That made a big difference in the summer too.

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I’m planning on doing the ceramic on my windshield and I’d like to have my whole hood wrapped

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