Hello Guest

Author Topic: What fuel has the longest shelf life?  (Read 5965 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Farmer Jon

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2346
    • View Profile
What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« on: January 05, 2016, 08:11:18 AM »
I got sucked into a tv show. Last man on earth.  Kind of dumb but I like it. One episode the gas turned bad. Turned into jell. I know that don't happen but one guy on there sad Hey I told you this would happen.  Diesel last longer.

Got me to thinking. A gallon can of gas will go bad in 8 months or a year.  Will a 500 gallon barrel go bad that fast or will that quantity stay good longer?
How long would the same gallon can of diesel last?
What about propane?
The military uses JP8 I don't know much about that except its jet fuel but like kerosene. Can it be used in diesel trucks? Most likely hard for a civilian to obtain.

Every farm has fuel storage. If something happened I just wonder how Long before we are out of usable fuel?  Don't want to waste fuel in a SHTF situation  but if it will go bad in a certain amount of time just as well use it. I know we have a few propane tanks that have been full for a couple years. Filled them to run the grain dryers and never needed them. How long before they go bad?

Father, husband, farmer, trucker, mechanic, equipment operator, ect

Offline stlaser

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 10205
  • Official PIA
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2016, 09:33:33 AM »
My understanding propane lasts until the tank rusts out & it then leaks out....
Living in the remote north hoping Ken doesn’t bring H up here any time soon…..

Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34018
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2016, 09:37:46 AM »
Diesel will last a very long time if it is in the ground and gets no light and not much temp fluctuation.
JP8 is hidden in the ground on military installations by the tens of millions of gallons. Diesel and Kerosene mix with prist. Prist is the anti algae additive necessary to keep bugs from growing in the gas and clogging up Apache helicopter engines while they are show-boatin' around trying to look cool!
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

Offline Wilbur

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 1538
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2016, 11:29:35 AM »
I know Stabil additive will work to keep gas longer but how long I don't know. I use it to keep gas in the mower etc over the winter. I like that better than running them dry as it keeps gaskets wet etc. But for years? I dunno. I have seen similar additives for diesel but don't know how long they would work - I'm assuming its similar to the Prist Don referred to but I don't know how long it would last. I also think in ground storage would be very different (better) than an above ground tank like a farm tank as the temp fluctuations would be minimized etc. but Im no oil engineer....nor do I play on on TV! ha!  :o

Offline KensAuto

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 7684
  • My abuser is named Nate
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2016, 11:36:07 AM »
Around here, gas can go bad in as little as 3 months, during the hottest months. I have found that Stabil is no match for the heat, but Seafoam is (somewhat).
The diesel in my 5 ton went bad this summer. I took it out this weekend and it started stalling. I smelled the tank, and it had a sweet type smell. Not sure if that's what algea does or not.....definately lack experience in that department....now I have 50+ gallons of diesel to drain...the tank needs cleaning anyway.
Underpaid and misunderstood since 2014

Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2016, 07:46:06 PM »
Somewhere a while back we had a post here about diesel shelf life. I did some research(Google fu) and came to the conclusion that max storage under ideal conditions is 12 years

Edit: and the right additive package

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
« Last Edit: January 05, 2016, 08:30:48 PM by TexasRedNeck »
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Farmer Jon

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2346
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2016, 07:32:31 AM »
If in ideal conditions it last 12 years, I suppose you could cut that in half or less if its in a 1000 gallon barrel above ground. Assuming it hasn't been used or stolen by then.
Father, husband, farmer, trucker, mechanic, equipment operator, ect

OldKooT

  • Guest
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2016, 07:50:35 AM »
The "official" shelf life for "pump" Diesel is roughly 28 days. Anything after that it starts to degrade. (straight from the man who sells us fuel)

Additives can prevent algae, and slow this breakdown process, but ultra low sulfur fuel has a very short shelf life. 

The local emergency management folks use pure Kero in standby gen sets and such in these parts. They change that out yearly also BTW.

Personal underground storage is all but impossible legally with EPA laws as they are.

If I was storing fuel for emergency use long term, I'd store Kero with additives or #1 in a pinch if possible. Heating oil where available is also viable.

Waste oil that's been processed free of water would be possibly the ideal option...for those that can run such stuff. Hydraulic fluids, and such have shown to store decades.

On the farm here we tend to try and cycle through fuel so none sits more than 4mo or so in the tanks. These new modern tractors and equipment have zero tolerance  to "old" fuel. The problem has become acute enough that fuel suppliers have been changing how they deliver fuel and are now offering on sight/infield delivery as a way to reduce the need for large quantities of fuel being stored in tanks on farms.

At the present rate of EPA restrictions, refinery changes in how fuel is made and other factors are slowly but assuredly creating a situation where diesel is NOT as viable a fuel for long term emergency use as it once was.

I would start looking at propane for a long term fuel storage situation these days. You can still own and store propane underground in large quantities without attracting attention, and it doesn't go bad.














Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34018
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2016, 11:47:12 AM »
^^ I have now said this multiple times. I believe long term storage of fuel should start as tanks of waste oil/transmission/hydraulic and other oils and petrol products.
Then when and if it is ever needed, simply filter off 60 gallons and process it into clean diesel and shove it into your tractor or truck.
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

Offline Spacecase544

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 66
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2016, 08:09:41 AM »
JP8 is no longer used by the military, everything has changed over to F24.  Similar, but a slightly higher freezing point (7 degrees if I remember correctly).  Storage life on F24 with no additives, straight out of the fuel farm to the HEMMT to the end vehicle is I believe 5 years.  I am not 100% sure on that anymore; it has been almost 18 months since I had any direct hands on contact with fueling operations.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk


Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Spacecase544

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 66
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2016, 12:42:14 PM »
I think I can call that close enough.  Haha.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk


Offline TexasRedNeck

  • punching bag for moderator humor
  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 11314
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2016, 06:13:41 PM »
Yep.  I know next to nothing about fuel so a little googlefu helped me understand
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

Joshua 6:20-24

Offline Farmer Jon

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2346
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2016, 09:11:01 AM »
The "official" shelf life for "pump" Diesel is roughly 28 days. Anything after that it starts to degrade. (straight from the man who sells us fuel)

Additives can prevent algae, and slow this breakdown process, but ultra low sulfur fuel has a very short shelf life. 

The local emergency management folks use pure Kero in standby gen sets and such in these parts. They change that out yearly also BTW.

Personal underground storage is all but impossible legally with EPA laws as they are.

If I was storing fuel for emergency use long term, I'd store Kero with additives or #1 in a pinch if possible. Heating oil where available is also viable.

Waste oil that's been processed free of water would be possibly the ideal option...for those that can run such stuff. Hydraulic fluids, and such have shown to store decades.

On the farm here we tend to try and cycle through fuel so none sits more than 4mo or so in the tanks. These new modern tractors and equipment have zero tolerance  to "old" fuel. The problem has become acute enough that fuel suppliers have been changing how they deliver fuel and are now offering on sight/infield delivery as a way to reduce the need for large quantities of fuel being stored in tanks on farms.

At the present rate of EPA restrictions, refinery changes in how fuel is made and other factors are slowly but assuredly creating a situation where diesel is NOT as viable a fuel for long term emergency use as it once was.

I would start looking at propane for a long term fuel storage situation these days. You can still own and store propane underground in large quantities without attracting attention, and it doesn't go bad.


Central Valley AG delivers our fuel. We have monitors on the tanks. When it gets so low they come fill them. Then we only get a bill for what we use. Basically even though the tanks are ours the fuel in not. They change the filters and do maintenance on the pumps and the monitors. The monitors are hooked into a land line telephone so the tank can call the office and say hey I'm getting empty. If we think there is a problem with the fuel they come an test it and do what they have to do to remedy the problem.

Our no1 fuel tanks truck and tractor will sometimes sit all summer full and we've never had a problem with it going bad over summer.
Father, husband, farmer, trucker, mechanic, equipment operator, ect

OldKooT

  • Guest
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2016, 07:59:56 PM »
If you are having no problems with #1 going bad that would be about normal. #1 stores pretty well yet compared to #2 pump fuel.

We could let our fuel supplier do as you are doing with the fuel tanks. But since I like to own what I may someday need, I don't sign up for such services on any fuels, including propane. Call me a control freak (some have lol) but my gramp's once told me when speaking of his WW2 experiences as a farm owner..."the government can't come take what they dunno you have" Since they took his and his neighbors tractors, equipment, crops and water during WW2 I don't imagine they'd be any less shy these days. (they never got his hidden still or tractor he kept well stashed, and that saved the farm)

Besides.... I am also able to shop for fuel prices from any supplier...which has proven rewarding most years. I just topped off all our propane storage at well under market. I ran the Diesel tanks almost dry across the farm, and just refilled them all recently since the price is down.

Anyway....my advice, be careful with plans to store fuel long term... things are changing.









Offline Farmer Jon

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2346
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2016, 08:10:57 AM »
No its not going bad over summer But I should drain the hose. Just whats in the hose changes color.

Ive heard stories about that in WW2 My grandpa served while his younger brothers and dad farmed. They still had horses. The government must have had enough so they didn't take anything.

My boss told me stories abut his dad during that time also. Being the youngest and his brothers already over seas they let him stay home. You couldn't buy a tractor at that time. His uncle was a shady character and  car dealer. He found a Allis Chalmers wd on the black market.  That was the first tractor on this farm that I work at.

My boss, the man the with check book don't believe in all this prepper stuff. I was just wondering how long we might have with what we got.
Father, husband, farmer, trucker, mechanic, equipment operator, ect

OldKooT

  • Guest
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2016, 12:01:41 PM »
I would bet if you asked the fella that delivers your fuel for the additives package added, you'd be able to get a fair idea regarding longevity in storage from that. Or just take 2 gallons, put it in a semi clear jug and toss it in the corner of some shed and watch it and see.

I am not much of a believer in "prepping" myself honestly. But I have been around the world a little, have seen what happens when a individual doesn't live in a manor that allows himself a certain degree of self sufficiency.

Being on a farm you know the drill. It just makes sense to keep extra's of what you need/use to keep the place running. I see extra fuel a lot like a bolt bin in the shop...Darn handy when/if you need it.

I buy hydraulic fluids, oils, filters in bulk. My general operational concept is a minimal of one years supplies. Some think I am nuts because I will "stock" a dozen or more pivot tires... but then they come ask me if they can buy one at 8pm on a Saturday night LoL




Offline Farmer Jon

  • Registered
  • **
  • Posts: 2346
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2016, 08:52:04 AM »
Yea we get that by bulk also along with antifreeze.  Antifreeze is hard to do in bulk. Got the green stuff. All the newer equipment has red or orange. Being partially color blind that is a challenge. I have to ask someone all the time.
Father, husband, farmer, trucker, mechanic, equipment operator, ect

Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34018
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2016, 10:07:26 AM »
Yea we get that by bulk also along with antifreeze.  Antifreeze is hard to do in bulk. Got the green stuff. All the newer equipment has red or orange. Being partially color blind that is a challenge. I have to ask someone all the time.
You could add say, cherry flavor to one type, then peach to another

Then all you'd have to do is take a sip of it to determine which type you're dealin' with!

Never mind the arsenic and all that, probably just flush out your system! :o :o :o
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

Offline cudakidd53

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 3142
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2016, 10:24:00 AM »
Yea we get that by bulk also along with antifreeze.  Antifreeze is hard to do in bulk. Got the green stuff. All the newer equipment has red or orange. Being partially color blind that is a challenge. I have to ask someone all the time.
You could add say, cherry flavor to one type, then peach to another

Then all you'd have to do is take a sip of it to determine which type you're dealin' with!

Never mind the arsenic and all that, probably just flush out your system! :o :o :o

You sound like those guys who use old radiators in their still construction Don........baah, the alcohol will make it safe.......drink up!
2012 Silverado LTZ - Duramax
Christian since 1975 - Field Trial Brittanys - NRA Lifetime Member

"When you're dead, you don't know you're dead. Hence, dealing with this fact is not difficult. It is only hard for those still living around you.....It's the same when you're stupid."

Offline Flyin6

  • Head cook and bottle washer
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 34018
    • View Profile
Re: What fuel has the longest shelf life?
« Reply #21 on: January 17, 2016, 01:53:15 PM »
I have been studying proper still construction.

Not the hard part

Waiting on the stuff to cook is!
Site owner    Isaiah 6:8, Psalm 91 
NSDQ      Author of the books: Distant Thunder and Thoren

 

SimplePortal 2.3.6 © 2008-2014, SimplePortal