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Offline wilsonphil

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Need armor advise
« on: February 10, 2016, 10:31:44 PM »
No matter what I use I keep blowing holes in every thing I shoot with my new rifle
« Last Edit: February 15, 2016, 09:20:27 AM by BobbyB »

Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2016, 10:52:53 PM »
What are you shooting and what is the purpose for the armor?

If you are looking for a target that can stand up to the rigors of rifle rounds, here is a place you might give a shot (pun...get it?)

http://www.shootsteel.com/

I have several of their and they hold up well.
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Offline wilsonphil

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2016, 11:39:35 PM »
Once the picture is approved you will see what I'm up against

Offline BobbyB

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2016, 02:53:53 AM »
Once the picture is approved you will see what I'm up against

Approved. Now what did you shoot that with, and how thick is that plate?

EDIT: It appears from the background that you shoot plates a lot.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2016, 02:55:20 AM by BobbyB »
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2016, 06:18:03 AM »
hmm.  You shooting the 50bmg? 410 Cheytac?

http://www.shootsteel.com/50-bmg-target-12x20/

These are rated for 50bmg at 400yards...unless you are pulling our leg and your are shooting black tip AP

In that case you are on your own.
Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

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Offline cudakidd53

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2016, 07:02:14 AM »
I suspect some experimental NASA stuff from our resident "Rocket Scientist" and the plastic chunk is the projectile............look closely behind right side materials with craters in them!
« Last Edit: February 11, 2016, 07:04:50 AM by cudakidd53 »
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2016, 08:45:50 AM »
I think someone's pulling our legs!
Rifle? .....or......

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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2016, 09:50:04 AM »
Oooh. Maybe a mag pulse rail gun!


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Kids today don't know how easy they have it. When I was young, I had to walk 9 feet through shag carpet to change the TV channel.

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Offline EL TATE

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2016, 12:35:42 PM »
Oooh. Maybe a mag pulse rail gun!


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That was my thought. I'm excited!
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2016, 12:39:15 PM »
Oooh. Maybe a mag pulse rail gun!


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That was my thought. I'm excited!

You're both wrong. That's clearly the result of a shot from a phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range.

So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

Offline Flyin6

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2016, 12:46:58 PM »
I've seen stuff...results like that

But not from a rifle

Cannon with a HEAT projectile

Am I right?

Edit: But what would a rocket company guy be doing with a cannon???
Not a star wars particle beam weapon...Read sifi and saw the results from those..nice neat hole, not blast cone from absorption of an enormous force.

So a projectile...Going really fast...maybe faster than normal propellants can drive...Not plastic, unless fired in a vacuum...possibly aluminum...going really fast.

Man I am stuck on this really fast kinetic energy thing

So what's the joke? You guys trying out how to stop micro meteorites left over from some super nova? Know anyone over at DARPA? They might know...
« Last Edit: February 11, 2016, 12:55:13 PM by Flyin6 »
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2016, 01:19:37 PM »

....You guys trying out how to stop micro meteorites left over from some super nova?

This is what's going through my (small) brain..
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Offline EL TATE

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2016, 01:24:29 PM »
Since he was asking about the armor and not how the holes got there, probably right, shucks.
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2016, 02:12:54 PM »
Cannon with a HEAT projectile

Looked SABOTish to me.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

Offline cudakidd53

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2016, 04:24:55 PM »
Reminds me of a line from The Martian- "I'm gonna need to science the $:@% outta this"  :o
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2016, 04:36:31 PM »

I've seen stuff...results like that

But not from a rifle

Cannon with a HEAT projectile

Am I right?

Edit: But what would a rocket company guy be doing with a cannon???
Not a star wars particle beam weapon...Read sifi and saw the results from those..nice neat hole, not blast cone from absorption of an enormous force.

So a projectile...Going really fast...maybe faster than normal propellants can drive...Not plastic, unless fired in a vacuum...possibly aluminum...going really fast.

Man I am stuck on this really fast kinetic energy thing

So what's the joke? You guys trying out how to stop micro meteorites left over from some super nova? Know anyone over at DARPA? They might know...

Every time I hear HEAT rounds I think about my other tanker buddy. He had two great sayings. "There is nothing like a 120mm smooth bore to get your heart right." And " I loved sending rounds down range with hate and discontent. "


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Offline Nate

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2016, 04:50:43 PM »
I am with bobby on this one don, that looks more like a sabot round hole.  I saw 1 or a few of those during the invasion, and I must say WOW!
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Offline Nate

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2016, 04:51:52 PM »
I wouldn't say hate and discontent RN, I would say without discrimination of what the target was or contained!  ;D

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Offline Flyin6

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2016, 09:05:49 PM »
Sabot...Yea, I could see that.

I shot a lot of 105mm Sabot and know what that would do. I can only imagine how that amped up 120mm smoothbore treats things. My guess is it's all bad on the receiving end!
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2016, 10:56:45 PM »
Just once, I would like to be standing nearby when the 120mm lit off....

That has to be freaking awsome
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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2016, 07:49:47 AM »
It is.  There are actually 4 projectiles flying down range when they touch off a sabot.  Those three petals have to go somewhere.  Always a concern when we were in the breach.
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Offline Flyin6

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2016, 09:11:28 AM »
It is.  There are actually 4 projectiles flying down range when they touch off a sabot.  Those three petals have to go somewhere.  Always a concern when we were in the breach.
I don't know about the 120mm, but you could not fire service sabot from a 105mm with friendlies within 200M either side of the tube up to 900 meters downrange as the sabot itself flying apart, releasing that 37mm dart would easily kill a man
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Offline Atkinsmatt

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2016, 11:36:42 AM »
120 is the same.  I always felt better reminding them before hand.
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Offline OldKooT

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #23 on: February 17, 2016, 11:12:09 AM »
Looks to me like a fine weapon for Coyotes whatever it is.  ;D

I always thought shooting a coyote with a tungsten projectile would be amusing.

Sorry... I will now defer to those that are more serious about such things. 
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Offline wilsonphil

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #24 on: February 17, 2016, 11:21:54 AM »
Ok so Don wins the $5 dollar windup toy that actually runs (unlike squareD), he got the got pretty close to what you are seeing here.  This damage is caused by a projectile propelled by what is known as a light gas gun, the speed of the projectile is traveling around 7KPS (kilometer per second). 

One very big real hazard in orbit is MMOD(micro meteorite object damage) strikes there is so much crab floating around up there now it has become a real concern.  The damage you see in the pictures was caused by a 1? 25gm polycarbonate(plastic) slug.  These targets are in a vacuum chamber to simulate space environment.

 Most of what is up there we can track it?s the smaller particle?s that cause the most concern because they can rip thru a capsule so you have to design a protection system to protect the pressure vessel, lots of voodoo sometimes but lots of fun.

Offline Flyin6

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2016, 11:25:18 AM »
Yippee!
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Offline OldKooT

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2016, 11:26:40 AM »
Plastic eh?  So basically ya all made a tater gun for space?
Norm

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Offline Flyin6

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2016, 11:35:01 AM »
^^^^^ Farmers  ;) ^^^^^
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Offline KensAuto

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2016, 12:17:24 PM »
Was that aluminum in the last pic? What was the projectile in the last one...plastic as well?
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Offline Farmer Jon

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2016, 01:08:01 PM »
I've been following quietly as I often do. Taking it all in so to speak.  So if I have this straight. You made a gun to simulate MMOD on earth with the purpose of developing a shield to put on spacecraft?

If this were to be fired on earth not in a vaccum what would happen? Flying 7kps the plastic slug would melt no?
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Offline EL TATE

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #30 on: February 17, 2016, 01:09:13 PM »
Very cool. I would wager the last was concrete. no full penetration but significant spalling towards the rear.
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Offline wilsonphil

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #31 on: February 17, 2016, 02:12:52 PM »
I've been following quietly as I often do. Taking it all in so to speak.  So if I have this straight. You made a gun to simulate MMOD on earth with the purpose of developing a shield to put on spacecraft?

If this were to be fired on earth not in a vaccum what would happen? Flying 7kps the plastic slug would melt no?

You will never attain that kind of speed in atmospheric conditions so 7KPS = just shy of 23,000fps, so yes the projectile would heat and vaporize.

Offline wilsonphil

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #32 on: February 17, 2016, 02:14:14 PM »
Very cool. I would wager the last was concrete. no full penetration but significant spalling towards the rear.

The second picture is 6061/T6 billet 6" thick, 

Offline EL TATE

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #33 on: February 17, 2016, 02:15:51 PM »
Good grief Charlie brown! you guys have too much fun.
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Offline Sammconn

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2016, 03:35:26 PM »
Wow! I'd also been setting back and taking it in.
That's some serious velocity and some cool stuff.
Thanks for sharing! This is too cool.
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2016, 09:58:14 PM »
23000 ft per second...holy moly, that's faster than my Duramax!!!!!!!!
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Offline TexasRedNeck

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2016, 10:13:30 PM »
23000 ft per second...holy moly, that's faster than my Duramax downhill with smoking brakes and a camper behind it

fixed it for ya
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Offline Sammconn

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2016, 10:22:55 PM »
Now that's ^ accurately funny!
I just don't want to wind up missing a digit or limb.  I can sometimes get in a hurry to get results.
Sam

Offline KensAuto

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Re: Need armor advise
« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2016, 10:49:55 PM »
Now don't go messin' up Mr phil's awesome thread like that. Darn kids. :P
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