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Offline kampfitt

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9mm AR-15
« on: December 06, 2014, 09:22:09 AM »
What do you guys think of a 9mm AR for the Wife as a home defense gun. I'm thinking short ,light, no recoil it won't go thru all the walls in the house, but still has 32 rds  and load it with good home defense rounds it should be good for close quarters. What brands should I look at and which to stay away from. Thanks
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2014, 09:47:59 AM »
Man, I have to say I just don't like it

You can buy high capacity 9mm pistols for a heck of a lot less and wrapping a rifle around the inferior 9mm bullet only makes the thing bulky without increasing effectiveness.

If you want 32 rounds, then a Glock 19 with a Korean Army 32 round magazine will get that done.

Home defense: 9mm pistol is OK, bigger is better.

For rifle, I'd have to give the AK the nod over the AR every day of the week, twice on Saturdays. Their gun is just better at putting bullets out. Granted they don't always go where you aimed them, but most of the time...

AR is a high velocity .22 squirrel gun. Close range a definite killer, but beyond 90-100 meters not so much.

King of home defense 12 gage shooting say #4-#2 or 00 buckshot. I like the latter. It's what I use along with a few .45's and now .40's

Sorry to rain on your parade, not my intent, I just see no practical application for a 9mm rifle...
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2014, 06:19:02 PM »
What do you guys think of a 9mm AR for the Wife as a home defense gun. I'm thinking short ,light, no recoil it won't go thru all the walls in the house, but still has 32 rds  and load it with good home defense rounds it should be good for close quarters. What brands should I look at and which to stay away from. Thanks

If your and your wife think it'll be a good option, then that's what really matters. Do I think there is a valid point in what Chief, said about having a pistol, yes, I do. However, is she wants the 9mm in a rifle format then, go for it.

The 9mm is a low recoil, generally accurate round for what you want to do use it for. The Russians' even have a "sniper rifle" chambered in 9mm that is suppressed so it does have tactical usage. Granted it's not 9x19 para but you get my point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VSS_Vintorez

As for brands to look at/choose/avoid.. That's a bit harder as I'm not sure how many makers there are out there. I think most of them are just 9mm uppers that connect to a standard lower.

In the end, go with what makes you and the household 6 happy. If you can use it effectively then that's what matters.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2014, 07:20:11 PM »
That Russian bad boy is a 9 X 39 not the pistol 9 X 19.

That pistol cartridge is just not that powerful. Witness all the little haji people we shot with it overseas...They survive usually. But it should keep an attacker off your butt unless he/she is amped on something. I know a guy who shot a large woman 5 times with a .45 and she still had enough juice remaining to plunge a knife into his buddy's shoulder! She died enroute to the hospital. She was high on something.

The likelihood of a home invader being amped on something is high. That's another reason I like the 12 gage option or the .45 auto. Those cartridges tend to equalize any positive effects any drug or combination of drugs might bring to the aid of the invader...
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2014, 11:18:31 PM »
That Russian bad boy is a 9 X 39 not the pistol 9 X 19.

That pistol cartridge is just not that powerful. Witness all the little haji people we shot with it overseas...They survive usually. But it should keep an attacker off your butt unless he/she is amped on something. I know a guy who shot a large woman 5 times with a .45 and she still had enough juice remaining to plunge a knife into his buddy's shoulder! She died enroute to the hospital. She was high on something.

The likelihood of a home invader being amped on something is high. That's another reason I like the 12 gage option or the .45 auto. Those cartridges tend to equalize any positive effects any drug or combination of drugs might bring to the aid of the invader...

I know it's x39. It's basically the 9mm on top of an AK round, in simple terms.

I had more of an answer, but my typing skills decided, I don't need to type longer replies with any sort of clarity. I'll re-attempt in the morning.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2014, 07:54:19 AM »
We're good...
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #6 on: December 11, 2014, 11:37:33 AM »
If your stuck on pistol caliber rifle look at these and they run Glock mags http://www.tnwfirearms.com/product-p/asrx-cplt-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx.htm I have one in .40 and its light and easy to maneuver. They also just came out with these http://www.tnwfirearms.com/product-p/aspx-cplt-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx.htm But as Don stated 12ga is best home defense and you can get recoil reduction stocks. My little Hitler (ie: wife is 5' nothing and 120#) and she can operate any of the 12ga's with the recoil reduction stocks with little issue. She's mean though so that might having something to do with it...... :o

Worth mentioning is that these TN guns have screw on take down barrels so they may be multi purpose in the excitement potentially coming our way just my 2 cents
« Last Edit: December 11, 2014, 11:43:29 AM by stlaser »
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #7 on: December 11, 2014, 01:21:10 PM »
Ok here's my more coherent response.

I agree with Chief that a 9mm pistol would be better than a rifle. A 12 ga would be better than a pistol and rifle in HD. However, I will now diverge from that path of cohesion we had, slightly. If you are set on a 9mm AR then get one, some will take the 30 or 32 rd 9mm mags. But, also look into a 9mm pistol that can use the same mags...

See where I'm going with this. Same ammo, same mags, less confusion in the dark, and less requirement to grab different ammo for different calibers. IF you can swap mags between pistol and AR then, your wife will be set for whatever the situation dictates.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2014, 11:10:50 AM by BobbyB »
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2014, 04:05:20 PM »
If your stuck on pistol caliber rifle look at these and they run Glock mags http://www.tnwfirearms.com/product-p/asrx-cplt-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx.htm I have one in .40 and its light and easy to maneuver. They also just came out with these http://www.tnwfirearms.com/product-p/aspx-cplt-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx.htm But as Don stated 12ga is best home defense and you can get recoil reduction stocks. My little Hitler (ie: wife is 5' nothing and 120#) and she can operate any of the 12ga's with the recoil reduction stocks with little issue. She's mean though so that might having something to do with it...... :o

Worth mentioning is that these TN guns have screw on take down barrels so they may be multi purpose in the excitement potentially coming our way just my 2 cents


Shawn,

Sort of spendy...

Did you pay $799?? Or let me ask it this way...Can one get a better price than that for that gun.

I like it. Make a nice take down in .40 while using the G27 sidearm and maybe scoring some 32 round Korean mags
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2014, 08:07:48 PM »
Yeah 8 bills is a little pricey for a gun you can't fondle prior to purchasing. To answer that question no I didn't pay that much. I did a pre order before production started & picked it up for 6 bills I think. I liked (being a lefty) that it will discharge the shell either right or left. It is well made & I think I would pay the 8 bills now after owning it. I've also owned a keltec sub2000 that is a folder & uses same glock mags. It was junk in comparison which is the reason I no longer own it.

This company TNW also makes this in a .45 as well and there is a kit you can buy (comes all enclosed in its own pack) that allows you to change this firearm between 9mm, .40 & .45 so I think that was also a pretty slick idea. http://www.tnwfirearms.com/product-p/asrx-cplt-9445-xxxx-xxxx.htm

They now have better color options & will thread the barrel end as well for a flash hider or muffler or one of them there oil collecting devices so you don't pollute the outdoors with nasty contaminants.....
« Last Edit: December 12, 2014, 07:09:13 AM by stlaser »
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Offline kampfitt

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2014, 08:34:05 AM »
Hey Guys I should have given a little more background, my wife has guillain-barr? syndrome it's like MS. She has a Kimber Ultra in 9mm as her CC gun and can handle it pretty well, she's a good shot. She's home alone a lot, I work 3am-3:30pm a lot. and she was thinking she wanted a little more than just her handgun if some one is trying to break in, so she can stand her ground from master bedroom or from her craft room in the basement till the good guys arrive. We have tried 20ga shotgun a little to much kick if she is having one of her flareups her and hands aren't working the best. That was what started my thinking about a small AR for her, she's shot my sons full size BushMaster 20" barrel but it's to long and heavy for her. So I would like to find something that would work for her. Also how many wives ask for a new home defense gun! PS. our county just cut all sheriff road patrols because of the budget!! We'll have to wait for the State Troopers arrive!
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2014, 08:50:54 AM »
Hey Guys I should have given a little more background, my wife has guillain-barr? syndrome it's like MS. She has a Kimber Ultra in 9mm as her CC gun and can handle it pretty well, she's a good shot. She's home alone a lot, I work 3am-3:30pm a lot. and she was thinking she wanted a little more than just her handgun if some one is trying to break in, so she can stand her ground from master bedroom or from her craft room in the basement till the good guys arrive. We have tried 20ga shotgun a little to much kick if she is having one of her flareups her and hands aren't working the best. That was what started my thinking about a small AR for her, she's shot my sons full size BushMaster 20" barrel but it's to long and heavy for her. So I would like to find something that would work for her. Also how many wives ask for a new home defense gun! PS. our county just cut all sheriff road patrols because of the budget!! We'll have to wait for the State Troopers arrive!

You're still saying shotgun to me.

If she has a flare and is shaking, why have a weapon in her hands that requires precise bullet placement?

And a 9mm really needs decent placement to stop and that won't work if he is a big guy with, I am assuming a heavy coat. 9mm is just not enough especially if it does not connect with something that turns the lights out.

Can you get her on paper while she is not feeling so well? See if she can print at all?

Shotgun, cylinder bore...#2-buckshot...shaking doesn't matter
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2014, 08:54:22 AM »
Yeah 8 bills is a little pricey for a gun you can't fondle prior to purchasing. To answer that question no I didn't pay that much. I did a pre order before production started & picked it up for 6 bills I think. I liked (being a lefty) that it will discharge the shell either right or left. It is well made & I think I would pay the 8 bills now after owning it. I've also owned a keltec sub2000 that is a folder & uses same glock mags. It was junk in comparison which is the reason I no longer own it.

This company TNW also makes this in a .45 as well and there is a kit you can buy (comes all enclosed in its own pack) that allows you to change this firearm between 9mm, .40 & .45 so I think that was also a pretty slick idea. http://www.tnwfirearms.com/product-p/asrx-cplt-9445-xxxx-xxxx.htm

They now have better color options & will thread the barrel end as well for a flash hider or muffler or one of them there oil collecting devices so you don't pollute the outdoors with nasty contaminants.....

I like your thinkin!

Nother subject...Duane and I were over at the Field and Stream store yestertag

Had my grippers on the Ruger SR-762.

Piston gun in, well, 7.62.

I bet it would be every infantryman's dream gun if it ever hit the Armee or Marines
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2014, 09:31:07 AM »
I built a 7.62 gas system ar off the same upper and lower as the Ruger 7.62 (blanks come from same shop as ruger gets them) It was definitely a headache (ordered wrong parts several times) and the action was pretty tight when I finished the build. I have ran several mags thru it at different times with white lithium grease (boy is that messy) trying to heat it up and break the action in. It is getting better but thinking the system may be over gassed slightly so looking into an adjustable gas block now. Moral of the story the big price tag on the ruger looks inexpensive in comparison.........
Unretired, sweeping floor at GLO once again & making coffee.

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2014, 09:50:05 AM »
I built a 7.62 gas system ar off the same upper and lower as the Ruger 7.62 (blanks come from same shop as ruger gets them) It was definitely a headache (ordered wrong parts several times) and the action was pretty tight when I finished the build. I have ran several mags thru it at different times with white lithium grease (boy is that messy) trying to heat it up and break the action in. It is getting better but thinking the system may be over gassed slightly so looking into an adjustable gas block now. Moral of the story the big price tag on the ruger looks inexpensive in comparison.........
Speaking of price tags...

F & S tag said $1999!!!!!

I told them it should be $1549

They said they'd price match, so I started looking up CDNN on my I-Phone

THe sales person said, nossir, only local stores within 50 miles

So I didn't get that little toy...But I sure do like it

I'm a big guy and for me 7.62 has a wooden stock, is made by springfield, and is really long

I have to break myself out of that mold

A shorty 16-18" barrel pushing all that power would work very nicely

Springfield...AR...Springfield...AR...Spri...
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2014, 11:16:38 AM »
I bet it would be every infantryman's dream gun if it ever hit the Armee or Marines

I prefer the M14, but I'll give everything a fair shake.


I built a 7.62 gas system ar off the same upper and lower as the Ruger 7.62 (blanks come from same shop as ruger gets them) It was definitely a headache (ordered wrong parts several times) and the action was pretty tight when I finished the build. I have ran several mags thru it at different times with white lithium grease (boy is that messy) trying to heat it up and break the action in. It is getting better but thinking the system may be over gassed slightly so looking into an adjustable gas block now. Moral of the story the big price tag on the ruger looks inexpensive in comparison.........

I was going to ask you how that project ever turned out. In addition to the adjustable gas block there are heavier buffer springs, that'll help smooth things out. I'll try and find the ones I've seen and post them up for you. The gear site I gave you end up helping you out?


A shorty 16-18" barrel pushing all that power would work very nicely

Springfield...AR...Springfield...AR...Spri...

Try looking at the DPMS LR-308 AP4. The only "problem" with a 7.62/.308 chambered in a 16" barrel is the flash, and blast coming from the business end. 16" is barely allowing the powder to burn off, sorta like the short M44 carbines chambered in 54R. Everyone trash talks DPMS, but their SASS model was part of the SASS project the military had put on when they ended up with the M110. Their 7.62/.308s' are nice, and cheaper than alot of the others, which means more money to modify to your liking and the inevitable bullets, you will be shooting. Also get PMAGs, they make a 20-25 rd PMAG for the 308. They feed better and have less issues than the issued steel mag.

Here's a list of the AR 308s they have.
http://www.dpmsinc.com/308-WIN-762-NATO-16-18_ep_190-1.html

Here's the AP4 specifically:
http://www.dpmsinc.com/AP4-308762-NATO_ep_125-1.html


« Last Edit: December 12, 2014, 11:32:58 AM by BobbyB »
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2014, 12:18:59 PM »
I was going to ask you how that project ever turned out. In addition to the adjustable gas block there are heavier buffer springs, that'll help smooth things out. I'll try and find the ones I've seen and post them up for you. The gear site I gave you end up helping you out?

http://heavybuffers.com/ this is where I purchased my buffer.....

& yes, I purchased through the gear site you recommended. Nice stuff........
« Last Edit: December 12, 2014, 12:24:11 PM by stlaser »
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2014, 01:05:47 PM »
Copy on the pistole ammo not having the punch

However, comma

Bubbas started using .45 on the haji form

Worked prudy good

5.56: I like it

Trained one of my girlies when she was maybe 15 on a 14.5" AR gun. she was absolutely deadly with that gun

CM
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2014, 01:32:13 PM »
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #19 on: December 13, 2014, 08:34:31 AM »
HP...Excellent point!
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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2015, 01:32:32 PM »
So what's the end result look like? What barrel /length did you go with?
Sorry for the long delayed response. I bought a mega arms 18" 1:10 twist via aim for a steal. I just purchased a JP adjustable gas block for it & installed it today. Left the free float hand guard off. Once it warms up a bit I'm gunna take it out & dial gas block in. Once it's assembled & clean free of all the white Latium grease mess I'll snap some pics.
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Offline BobbyB

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Re: 9mm AR-15
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2015, 02:32:34 PM »
Sorry for the long delayed response. I bought a mega arms 18" 1:10 twist via aim for a steal. I just purchased a JP adjustable gas block for it & installed it today. Left the free float hand guard off. Once it warms up a bit I'm gunna take it out & dial gas block in. Once it's assembled & clean free of all the white Latium grease mess I'll snap some pics.

Nice. No real rush, we all got craziness in our lives that take up 99% of the time.
So, Bobby...being the calculating trained warrior NCO that you are.  Take the appropriate action, Execute!